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Anonymous
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Did I miss something? In the listing of specs and comparisons for the 2 trim levels there is no talk of navigation
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openminded
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- Mar 31, 2016
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- 7
From what I can see looks like you're right - they are backing off and letting Android Auto and Apply CarPlay do their thing.
For the cheapest solution, you could use an old Android phone and connect to the Bolt's hotspot. Data service for that is $10 per month according to GM.
For the cheapest solution, you could use an old Android phone and connect to the Bolt's hotspot. Data service for that is $10 per month according to GM.
GetOffYourGas
Well-known member
openminded said:For the cheapest solution, you could use an old Android phone and connect to the Bolt's hotspot. Data service for that is $10 per month according to GM.
You shouldn't have to pay $10/mo for something like Navigation. Maps don't change daily, and we shouldn't have to use data in order to pull them constantly. Not to mention the fact that when I want maps the most is when I'm in the middle of nowhere. And often I don't have cell service in the middle of nowhere. And I'm not talking about the wide open desert out west. There are plenty of places in the mountains of NY where I lose service.
Most cars with nav systems have it as an option only on the highest trim levels or bundled with packages like high end stereo systems. Auto makers use third party software and data, need to pay for it, and pass that cost (and them some) along to consumers. Map updates typically run about $150 per year so to stay relatively current costs more than the $10/month.GetOffYourGas said:openminded said:For the cheapest solution, you could use an old Android phone and connect to the Bolt's hotspot. Data service for that is $10 per month according to GM.
You shouldn't have to pay $10/mo for something like Navigation. Maps don't change daily, and we shouldn't have to use data in order to pull them constantly. Not to mention the fact that when I want maps the most is when I'm in the middle of nowhere. And often I don't have cell service in the middle of nowhere. And I'm not talking about the wide open desert out west. There are plenty of places in the mountains of NY where I lose service.
You can always purchase nav unit (Garmin/Tom Tom, etc). Many include lifetime maps and traffic for <$200.
GetOffYourGas
Well-known member
All well and good. But on a car that starts at $37,495, built-in navigation should be at least an option.
It IS an option, it's just not offered the same way you are used to seeing it. Utilize the built in 10" screen. I consider it a bargain that for <$100 plus $10/m (if you are in the extreme minority that don't already have a phone with a data plan) you can get a phone or tablet and data plan.GetOffYourGas said:All well and good. But on a car that starts at $37,495, built-in navigation should be at least an option.
SD card or CD/DVD based systems are expensive to update and always at least 6 months out of date. They also don't have anywhere near the POI information that can be obtained thru web based mapping programs.
If you want a Honda Fit with Nav, you have to step up from the base to the EX-L ($5K) then pony up an additional $1K for the Nav system itself.
Adding Nav to a Ford means upping at least one level from the base trim, then adding option packages that run from about $1300 to $2500+, plus $150/yr for map updates
For 99% of potential owners, using a smartphone app is cheaper, familiar, offers choices (not locked into whatever clunky UI the automaker has chosen), and perhaps most importantly - always up to date.
SeanNelson
Well-known member
Well, I'm sure there's a data cap on that $10/month fee. And the problem with using the WiFi hotspot is that your cell phone will go wild with updates and other activity because it thinks it's on a free connection, and that can eat up your data allocation pretty fast.openminded said:For the cheapest solution, you could use an old Android phone and connect to the Bolt's hotspot. Data service for that is $10 per month according to GM.
I'd love it if Garmin or one of their competitors would come out with a GPS model that supports Android Auto so you could project the unit's map onto the car's display. That way you'd get the benefits of cheap map updates without having to be tethered to (and pay for) your cellular connection, and you wouldn't have to find some kind of awkward place to mount it.
GetOffYourGas
Well-known member
DucRider said:It IS an option, it's just not offered the same way you are used to seeing it. Utilize the built in 10" screen. I consider it a bargain that for <$100 plus $10/m (if you are in the extreme minority that don't already have a phone with a data plan) you can get a phone or tablet and data plan.GetOffYourGas said:All well and good. But on a car that starts at $37,495, built-in navigation should be at least an option.
SD card or CD/DVD based systems are expensive to update and always at least 6 months out of date. They also don't have anywhere near the POI information that can be obtained thru web based mapping programs.
If you want a Honda Fit with Nav, you have to step up from the base to the EX-L ($5K) then pony up an additional $1K for the Nav system itself.
Adding Nav to a Ford means upping at least one level from the base trim, then adding option packages that run from about $1300 to $2500+, plus $150/yr for map updates
For 99% of potential owners, using a smartphone app is cheaper, familiar, offers choices (not locked into whatever clunky UI the automaker has chosen), and perhaps most importantly - always up to date.
No, I'm sorry, but that is not always an option. Read my original post again. It's not about having a cell phone or not. Even with a cell phone, there are plenty of places with zero service. Yet those places often have a clear view of the sky. GPS will still work, but if you require data service to have a map to overlay with your position, it is useless. Admittedly, this is an atypical use of the Bolt - driving it somewhere without cell service. But it is bound to happen.
As for price, how much data does navigation pull for a 5-hour car ride? I have a cell phone, sure, but Verizon will charge me $15 for every 1G I go over my plan for the month. Or I can upgrade my data plan for the extra unnecessary usage. Either way, that's an additional cost.
For the price of the car, it is a decision I am unhappy with.
SeanNelson
Well-known member
Google Maps has a feature called "Offline Areas" that lets you pre-download maps while you have a connection (WiFi, for instance) so that you can use them in an area without cell coverage, or with your data connection turned off. And there are other offline map applications for Android phones as well.GetOffYourGas said:No, I'm sorry, but that is not always an option. Read my original post again. It's not about having a cell phone or not. Even with a cell phone, there are plenty of places with zero service. Yet those places often have a clear view of the sky. GPS will still work, but if you require data service to have a map to overlay with your position, it is useless. Admittedly, this is an atypical use of the Bolt - driving it somewhere without cell service. But it is bound to happen.DucRider said:It IS an option, it's just not offered the same way you are used to seeing it. Utilize the built in 10" screen. I consider it a bargain that for <$100 plus $10/m (if you are in the extreme minority that don't already have a phone with a data plan) you can get a phone or tablet and data plan.GetOffYourGas said:All well and good. But on a car that starts at $37,495, built-in navigation should be at least an option.
I'm not an Apple user so I can't make any such claims for the iPhone, but it wouldn't surprise me if it had similar abilities.
SparkE
Well-known member
GetOffYourGas said:All well and good. But on a car that starts at $37,495, built-in navigation should be at least an option.
Fine - I'll call GM and tell them that they should add a $15,000 option to the Bolt to add navigation. It won't change anything, because everybody will do what they would have done anyways : use their phone for navigation, linked to the 10" screen. :roll:
As far as I know, Android Auto usually works via the car's USB port or bluetooth, but not via the car's WiFi. You would be using the phone's data plan, not the car's.
If all of this means I can use Google Maps and traffic, then that would be a good thing. In my current car, traffic is provided by SiriusXM, which requires a subscription and is not nearly as good as Google traffic.
If all of this means I can use Google Maps and traffic, then that would be a good thing. In my current car, traffic is provided by SiriusXM, which requires a subscription and is not nearly as good as Google traffic.
SeanNelson
Well-known member
...unless you connect the phone to the car's WiFi hotspot.Geo said:You would be using the phone's data plan, not the car's.
Of course the disadvantage of doing that is that the phone will think it's on a no-fee WiFi connection and enable downloading of software updates, etc. which can significantly increase the amount of data that's consumed.
During her CES keynote Mary Barra mentioned EV-specific routing to maximize range or stop at charging stations.
To me this suggests it's not simply an implementation of Google Maps or Apple Maps through Android Auto/CarPlay. They may be implementing this through the myChevrolet app.
Here's her quote:
Another way we are looking to save everyone's time is by offering navigation with EV-specific routing.
With EV Navigation mapping, Bolt EV gives options -- like routes that maximize your range or provide access to charging stations.
Bolt EV also offers an advanced range predictor, which accurately estimates driving range based on topography... temperature... and driving habits.
http://media.chevrolet.com/media/us/en/chevrolet/home.detail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2016/Jan/boltev/0106-barra-ces.html
To me this suggests it's not simply an implementation of Google Maps or Apple Maps through Android Auto/CarPlay. They may be implementing this through the myChevrolet app.
Here's her quote:
Another way we are looking to save everyone's time is by offering navigation with EV-specific routing.
With EV Navigation mapping, Bolt EV gives options -- like routes that maximize your range or provide access to charging stations.
Bolt EV also offers an advanced range predictor, which accurately estimates driving range based on topography... temperature... and driving habits.
http://media.chevrolet.com/media/us/en/chevrolet/home.detail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2016/Jan/boltev/0106-barra-ces.html
We have two Volts. One has nav but I never use it. Instead I use waze on my phone because of the adaptation to traffic
The other volt doesn't have nav but has on star which includes gps. So my wife simply calls onstar, talks to a person and tells him/her where she wants to go, and turn by turn directions appear on the screen plus by voice. She much prefers this to dealing with a conventional nav system
My Focus electric had nav and it was tightly integrated to the power system. It continuously calculated range and mileage reserves to the destination. This is very important in a electric car although not needed and not present in the volt
The other volt doesn't have nav but has on star which includes gps. So my wife simply calls onstar, talks to a person and tells him/her where she wants to go, and turn by turn directions appear on the screen plus by voice. She much prefers this to dealing with a conventional nav system
My Focus electric had nav and it was tightly integrated to the power system. It continuously calculated range and mileage reserves to the destination. This is very important in a electric car although not needed and not present in the volt
This is what I would consider "tightly integrated""michael said:My Focus electric had nav and it was tightly integrated to the power system. It continuously calculated range and mileage reserves to the destination. This is very important in a electric car although not needed and not present in the volt
If all those are integrated into a nav app, it becomes much more useful.Breezy said:During her CES keynote Mary Barra mentioned EV-specific routing to maximize range or stop at charging stations.
...
Another way we are looking to save everyone's time is by offering navigation with EV-specific routing.
With EV Navigation mapping, Bolt EV gives options -- like routes that maximize your range or provide access to charging stations.
Bolt EV also offers an advanced range predictor, which accurately estimates driving range based on topography... temperature... and driving habits.
My Fit EV nav offers 3 routing choices: fastest, shortest (less miles), and most economical. Usually, at least 2 out of the 3 are the same route. It looks only at speed limits, and does not take into account traffic, terrain or weather. I'm not sure if it accounts for stoplights, stop signs, etc.
DucRider said:This is what I would consider "tightly integrated""michael said:My Focus electric had nav and it was tightly integrated to the power system. It continuously calculated range and mileage reserves to the destination. This is very important in a electric car although not needed and not present in the volt
If all those are integrated into a nav app, it becomes much more useful.Breezy said:During her CES keynote Mary Barra mentioned EV-specific routing to maximize range or stop at charging stations.
...
Another way we are looking to save everyone's time is by offering navigation with EV-specific routing.
With EV Navigation mapping, Bolt EV gives options -- like routes that maximize your range or provide access to charging stations.
Bolt EV also offers an advanced range predictor, which accurately estimates driving range based on topography... temperature... and driving habits.
My Fit EV nav offers 3 routing choices: fastest, shortest (less miles), and most economical. Usually, at least 2 out of the 3 are the same route. It looks only at speed limits, and does not take into account traffic, terrain or weather. I'm not sure if it accounts for stoplights, stop signs, etc.
Ford does pretty much the same. More importantly it monitors energy consumption rate and let's you know how much reserve (or shortfall) of energy you will have upon reaching your destination. It also compute the consumption rate (Wh/mile) that you will need to maintain to reach your destination, and displays this together with instant and trip average consumption. This is what I meant by tightly coupled.
If you see the required Wh/mile climbing, you know that you are building reserves and will "make it". If you see it falling, you know that you are using too much and better get some energy or slow down.
It works pretty well.
JupiterMoon
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GetOffYourGas said:openminded said:For the cheapest solution, you could use an old Android phone and connect to the Bolt's hotspot. Data service for that is $10 per month according to GM.
You shouldn't have to pay $10/mo for something like Navigation. Maps don't change daily, and we shouldn't have to use data in order to pull them constantly. Not to mention the fact that when I want maps the most is when I'm in the middle of nowhere. And often I don't have cell service in the middle of nowhere. And I'm not talking about the wide open desert out west. There are plenty of places in the mountains of NY where I lose service.
Can't you download the maps onto the phone and use them offline? I do that with my Windows Phone all the time.
JupiterMoon
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- Dec 11, 2016
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Doesn't OnStar offer the Nav service on this car like it does on my Spark EV?
Having naviation that understood elevation gain/loss, road speeds, etc. and coupled that into your range estimates for that segment of the trip would have been great. I ended up having to do a lot of guessing on my trip which was not that easy. It's also hard to drive and actively search for a closer charger that's open without having to pull over and stop.
I understand the potential cost implications but it seems like a mis-step to not offer anything.
I understand the potential cost implications but it seems like a mis-step to not offer anything.
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