WetEV
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Phaseout of Federal tax credit for GM

Thu Dec 06, 2018 3:13 pm

https://insideevs.com/top-6-automakers- ... dit-limit/

So the phaseout starts. Full Federal Tax Credit of $7,500 (as far as I understand) continues to 1 April 2019, then reduces to $3,750 until 1 October 2019, then reduces to $1,875 until 1 April 2020.
#49 on the LEAF 100 mile club.
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
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theothertom
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Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2018 4:13 pm

Re: Phaseout of Federal tax credit for GM

Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:41 pm

I guess the law is the law, but Chevy's EV sales numbers are "inflated" due to the Volt. The Volt was good at the time, but only offered ~30 miles electric range. I wish the government would change the law so that only BEV's are counted. Oh well...

WetEV
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Location: Near Seattle

Re: Phaseout of Federal tax credit for GM

Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:26 am

theothertom wrote:I guess the law is the law, but Chevy's EV sales numbers are "inflated" due to the Volt. The Volt was good at the time, but only offered ~30 miles electric range. I wish the government would change the law so that only BEV's are counted. Oh well...


Plug in hybrids were a reasonable design choice in 2010. Batteries were far more expensive, and getting the most common commuting and other shorter trips on electric was a win. If gasoline price rose a bit, the Volt might have been a real winner. As it was, it was a gateway EV for a lot of people...

Battery prices below $300 per kWh put the squeeze on PHEVs and on conventional hybrids as well. Battery prices below $150 per kWh put the squeeze on ICEs.

Image
#49 on the LEAF 100 mile club.
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
2012 Leaf SL Red
2014 Leaf SL Red
Can't sit in a Bolt seat, hoping for better soon.
Or perhaps a Buick version? Buick Electra 225???

theothertom
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2018 4:13 pm

Re: Phaseout of Federal tax credit for GM

Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:18 pm

If I read the chart correctly, current US conditions for battery prices are around $200/KWh. Is that correct? IF so, that puts a 60KWh battery at $12K. I don't know what a gasoline engine costs but my thoughts are it's < $12K, which makes ICE a cheaper option. The chart compares EV battery cost to gasoline cost. There must be an assumption of electricity costs in the calculations that I missed. Anyway, I'm more interested in manufacturing costs. I believe when the price of EV's is about equal to ICE cars, people will adopt EV's a lot quicker.

Just as a data point, but a Kia Soul ICE MSRP is around 23K, while the Soul EV is around 33K. The 10K difference seems a bit high to me, but maybe it's because Kia is counting on customers getting the 7500 credit so the sticker shock won't be so bad ?

WetEV
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Re: Phaseout of Federal tax credit for GM

Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:36 pm

theothertom wrote:If I read the chart correctly, current US conditions for battery prices are around $200/KWh. Is that correct?


More like $150 per kWh.
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=155#p660

Tesla is claiming under $100 per kWh.

theothertom wrote:The chart compares EV battery cost to gasoline cost. There must be an assumption of electricity costs in the calculations that I missed.


Gasoline costs vary a lot. Electric costs don't from year to year, but can be rather different in different places. Assumption is national average.

theothertom wrote:I believe when the price of EV's is about equal to ICE cars, people will adopt EV's a lot quicker.


Yes, and this will vary somewhat by size of vehicle, but is going to start happening around 2025 if price trends continue.


theothertom wrote:Just as a data point, but a Kia Soul ICE MSRP is around 23K, while the Soul EV is around 33K. The 10K difference seems a bit high to me, but maybe it's because Kia is counting on customers getting the 7500 credit so the sticker shock won't be so bad ?


EV production is mostly battery cell supply limited. So why lower the price? Or advertise?
#49 on the LEAF 100 mile club.
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
2012 Leaf SL Red
2014 Leaf SL Red
Can't sit in a Bolt seat, hoping for better soon.
Or perhaps a Buick version? Buick Electra 225???

AyeJay
Posts: 27
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:57 pm

Re: Phaseout of Federal tax credit for GM

Mon Dec 10, 2018 4:51 pm

theothertom wrote:I guess the law is the law, Oh well...


I urge everyone here to please sign this petition re:

-- Tell the Senate: Don't kill the EV tax credit.

-- Support an extension of the EV tax credit.

https://pluginamerica.salsalabs.org/ref ... ddfee81120

"We need continued support to help consumers make the switch to driving electric. The $7,500 federal EV tax credit is a key policy that must be extended to work for more drivers for a longer time frame. The original tax credit has been a successful incentive so far, but the EV market is far from fully mature."

Thank You,

AJ
- 2017 Bolt EV LT ~ (2015 KIA Soul EV previously)
- 1982 VW Rabbit (Caddy) TDI Pickup

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