PackardV8
Posts: 138
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:39 pm

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:06 pm

The headline labeling the Bolt as "Ugly" is just clickbait. The styling is generic 4-door-hatchback, similar to a dozen others in the market today.

Agree completely the value is in the drivetrain. As a small car, the Bolt is just average. As a breakthrough BEV, it's uniquely wonderful.

As an ooold Bolt owner and a lifetime builder of ICE engines, we'll never buy another new ICE. Today, I see my engine building in the same category as the farrier, the dog trainer or the golf pro. We cater to obsolete, expensive, absolutely unnecessary hobbies.

jack vines
My vehicles
2017 Bolt Premier Cajun Red
2011 Saab 9-4X
2005 Saab 9-5
1998 Saab 9000 Aero
2004 Ford F250 6.0 Turbo Diesel
1963 Studebaker Avanti
1956 Studebaker Hawk custom with a supercharged Packard V8
1955 Studebaker custom pickup with a Packard V8

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1174
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 5:25 pm
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Thu Jan 14, 2021 3:26 pm

PackardV8 wrote:Today, I see my engine building in the same category as the farrier, the dog trainer or the golf pro. We cater to obsolete, expensive, absolutely unnecessary hobbies.


As someone who races sailboats for a hobby, I feel this in my soul. But being "unnecessary" doesn't mean your hobby isn't worth it if it gives you satisfaction.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier
2021 Mini Cooper SE Signature+

summit
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2016 11:13 pm

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:17 pm

the real reason for low sale volume: cheap gas ! remove oil/gas subsidies and let the market prices the real cost. Imagine $7/gal, guzzlers would be parked.

We have 2x 2017 Bolts, and have been very impressed for a 1st generation product. You can slap a bunch of solar PV on your roof and make your own juice, can't generate your own gasoline, nor biodiesel for that matter.

PackardV8
Posts: 138
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:39 pm

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Fri Jan 15, 2021 5:15 pm

summit wrote: You can slap a bunch of solar PV on your roof and make your own juice, can't generate your own gasoline, nor biodiesel
But for those of us in the frozen-far-north-end-of-nowhere, neither can one generate enough sunshine for solar to be cost-effective.

jack vines
My vehicles
2017 Bolt Premier Cajun Red
2011 Saab 9-4X
2005 Saab 9-5
1998 Saab 9000 Aero
2004 Ford F250 6.0 Turbo Diesel
1963 Studebaker Avanti
1956 Studebaker Hawk custom with a supercharged Packard V8
1955 Studebaker custom pickup with a Packard V8

summit
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2016 11:13 pm

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:20 pm

PackardV8 wrote:But for those of us in the frozen-far-north-end-of-nowhere, neither can one generate enough sunshine for solar to be cost-effective.

jack vines


I was hiking in Anchorage a couple years ago and saw houses with solar panels mounted on their sides facing southward. Besides for the low sun angle, a benefit is no snow accumulation. But your point is well taken, still, Germany is at pretty high latitude and there are lots of PVs

PackardV8
Posts: 138
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:39 pm

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Mon Jan 25, 2021 7:41 pm

summit wrote:
PackardV8 wrote:But for those of us in the frozen-far-north-end-of-nowhere, neither can one generate enough sunshine for solar to be cost-effective.

jack vines


I was hiking in Anchorage a couple years ago and saw houses with solar panels mounted on their sides facing southward. Besides for the low sun angle, a benefit is no snow accumulation. But your point is well taken, still, Germany is at pretty high latitude and there are lots of PVs
Some Frozen types are sufficiently environmentally conscious and active they will install solar even when not cost-effective. As to Germany, they have both high costs of electrical generation and a national policy to go green sooner than later. To that end, grid power is made prohibitively expensive and PV is subsidized.

FWIW, i've had a couple of professional PVl surveys done of my house and none of the installers will guarantee sufficient production for a ten-year payback.

jack vines
My vehicles
2017 Bolt Premier Cajun Red
2011 Saab 9-4X
2005 Saab 9-5
1998 Saab 9000 Aero
2004 Ford F250 6.0 Turbo Diesel
1963 Studebaker Avanti
1956 Studebaker Hawk custom with a supercharged Packard V8
1955 Studebaker custom pickup with a Packard V8

summit
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2016 11:13 pm

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:40 am

jack vines[/quote]


FWIW, i've had a couple of professional PVl surveys done of my house and none of the installers will guarantee sufficient production for a ten-year payback.

jack vines[/quote]

most installer calculation only consider electrical usage. Pay-back looks much better when consider gasoline costing as well, of course it depends on the vehicle's MPG

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1174
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 5:25 pm
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Tue Jan 26, 2021 2:32 pm

summit wrote:most installer calculation only consider electrical usage. Pay-back looks much better when consider gasoline costing as well, of course it depends on the vehicle's MPG

The trouble is, this is double-counting. If you convert from ICEV to BEV, you see those savings regardless of whether you went solar. So Jack's concern still stands.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier
2021 Mini Cooper SE Signature+

summit
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2016 11:13 pm

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:44 am

boy we are getting OT, but it's ok. The Bolt is definitely not ugly at all in my eyes.

It's not double counting if it's done right. Eliminating gasoline increase your e-cost, and solar PV reduces that cost. In my case, I even converted the home furnace & water heater to heat-pumps. So my "pay-back" calculation included my propane cost. Am now investigating those heat-pump (sold as ventless) cloth dryer.

Cheers,

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1174
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 5:25 pm
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: The Chevy Bolt Is the Ugly Car of the (Very Near) Future

Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:51 pm

summit wrote:boy we are getting OT, but it's ok. The Bolt is definitely not ugly at all in my eyes.

It's not double counting if it's done right. Eliminating gasoline increase your e-cost, and solar PV reduces that cost. In my case, I even converted the home furnace & water heater to heat-pumps. So my "pay-back" calculation included my propane cost. Am now investigating those heat-pump (sold as ventless) cloth dryer.

Cheers,


Oh but it is always double-counting. The increase to your e-cost is not as much as the decrease in your gasoline cost. That has nothing to do with PV.

But if telling yourself it does makes you happy, suit yourself.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier
2021 Mini Cooper SE Signature+

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