Now I'm Ready to Negotiate

Chevy Bolt EV Forum

Help Support Chevy Bolt EV Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

adamsocb

Active member
Joined
Nov 29, 2016
Messages
29
I believe I now have all of the data to know what a good Bolt Lease deal is. I just confirmed by reverse calculating this offer from Chevrolet.com that the Capital Cost Reduction rebate (CCR) is $2,500 and the "buy" Money Factor (what the bank charges) is 0.0005. If the money factor (Rent) is higher than this the dealer is making extra profit on the "Rent Charge"

The Residual reverse calculates to 60% so there is either a typo on the offer (should be 36,000 miles not 45,000, or GM Finance has increased the residual 2% more (not likely), I will assume a typo and continue to believe the GM Financial chart that has the 36 month Residual Values at LT 58%, 60%, & 61%; Premier 57%, 59%, & 60% for 45,000, 36,000, & 30,000 miles respectively.

For those that don't already know, you can calculate the Money Factor by dividing the monthly rent charge quoted by the (adjusted capitalized cost + residual) on the lease agreement.

The only Fees involved should be the Lease Acquisition Fee ($595), some minor Documentation Fees <$100 (I am using $80), and a small CA State Environmental/tire Fee <$20 (I am using $9). Licence and Registration (I am using $400 since the DMV calculator is not working). These can be either paid upfront or financed in the adjusted capitalized cost. I am calculating paid upfront, but it doesn't really matter since I am using a fixed $2500 "drive-off" and financing them would just mean a larger down payment which makes the net or adjusted capitalized cost the same (There is a slight advantage to paying for them upfront since you pay use tax on the CCR down payment)

The delta between Invoice and MSRP is $1,645 for a Base LT and $1,828 for a loaded Premier. The reserve credit is $200-$150 depending on whether the dealer is or isn't on GM Floor Plan. So dealer profit at MSRP without marking anything up is $1,845 to $2028. The profit on Rent Charge markup is 90%-70% depending on whether the dealer is or isn't on GM Floor Plan, so this seems to be where the dealer is making a "hidden" profit.

I am using $2,500 drive-off since that will be offset by the CA CVRP Rebate.

Bottom line:
Fair deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Base LT @ MSRP $36,620 (+$875 delivery) with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $382 per month. $15,886.26 Total of Payments
Great deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Base LT @ Invoice $35,155 (+$875 delivery) +$500 with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $352 per month. $14,825 Total of Payments

Fair deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on Loaded Premier @ MSRP $43,030 (+$875 delivery) with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $483 per month. $19,322.16 Total of Payments
Great deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Loaded Premier @ Invoice $41,202 (+$875 delivery) +$500 with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $439 per month. $17,861 Total of Payments

Now its off to see how little the dealers are willing to make. :mrgreen:
 
Do your monthly payments include sales tax?
And what money factor are you using?
 
Ac108 said:
Do your monthly payments include sales tax?
And what money factor are you using?

Yes, monthly payments and Capital Cost Reduction include 8% CA sales tax.

Money Factor is the GM Financial California and Oregon Supported Program Top Tier Credit A+ or A1 0.0005. Not available unless you are a resident of CA or OR. This is what GM Financial is charging, anything above 0.0005 is 90% profit for the dealer.
 
adamsocb said:
Bottom line:
Fair deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Base LT @ MSRP $36,620 (+$875 delivery) with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $382 per month. $15,886.26 Total of Payments
Great deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Base LT @ Invoice $36030 (+$875 delivery) +$500 with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $352 per month. $14,825 Total of Payments


Is it true that the difference between the Base LT MSRP and Invoice prices is only $590? Not a lot of room!
 
I suggest that you include two options in all of your calculations: the $750 DC Fast Charge port, and the $500 (?) Driver Comfort package, with heated seats and steering wheel. A few people may not want them but almost all will. It also seems that about half the folks interested in a Bolt want one of the $395 extra-charge exterior colors.
 
tgreene said:
Is it true that the difference between the Base LT MSRP and Invoice prices is only $590? Not a lot of room!


My Bad, the number was a typo. I have corrected. I also found out the Invoice price from Edmunds I was using does not include the approximately $850 for Dealer Contributions to advertising etc. So the effective invoice is more than I show above. Still not a lot of room, only about $1,000. However the holdback and finance credit is another $1,800-$1,900 so they make that too if they move the car quickly.
 
I made a deal with a Fleet Manager friend of mine. Here is the low-down.

The GMF Supported Money Factor IS 0.00072 which equals an APR of 1.73%, he showed me on the GMF system so apparently the 0.0005 MF is NOT currently available.

I am not going to post the final price to protect my relationship with my friend, but it was very fair. My MF is the 0.00072 (wholesale rate). I don't think a lower total of payments is possible right now unless you qualify for GM Supplier or Employee pricing.

I will check out the car in daylight tomorrow and if all is well, and the dealer's Finance & Insurance department doesn't modify the deal, pick it up.

For reference the car is a Cajun Red Premier with all options. MSRP $43,905 (inc. destination) 36 month, 36,000 mile, 59% residual, 0.00072 MF, 7.75% sales tax, $595 Lease Acquisition, $80 Doc Fee, $396 License & Registration

I calculated the payments at both MSRP and Invoice to show the range of a fair deal:

At MSRP agreed price, the deal would be $2,500 Drive-Off and $497 per month including all taxes and fees. Total of payments $19,883.

At effective Invoice ($42,077+$430.30 IMR+$430.30 LMA) = $42,938 agreed price, the deal would be $2,500 Drive-Off and $466 per month including all taxes and fees. Total of payments $18814.

By the way, the dealer gets a holdback of $1290 and Wholesale Finance Credit of $200 so they are still making a (gross) profit at invoice, however they do have to pay rent, wages, taxes, and utilities so that $1,500 won't go far.

Bottom Line Again -- A straight dealer will show you the actual GM Invoice from Detroit and the GM Financial Lease Worksheet for your offer. You can use this data to validate any deal you are offered.
 
adamsocb said:
I believe I now have all of the data to know what a good Bolt Lease deal is. I just confirmed by reverse calculating this offer from Chevrolet.com that the Capital Cost Reduction rebate (CCR) is $2,500 and the "buy" Money Factor (what the bank charges) is 0.0005. If the money factor (Rent) is higher than this the dealer is making extra profit on the "Rent Charge"

The Residual reverse calculates to 60% so there is either a typo on the offer (should be 36,000 miles not 45,000, or GM Finance has increased the residual 2% more (not likely), I will assume a typo and continue to believe the GM Financial chart that has the 36 month Residual Values at LT 58%, 60%, & 61%; Premier 57%, 59%, & 60% for 45,000, 36,000, & 30,000 miles respectively.

For those that don't already know, you can calculate the Money Factor by dividing the monthly rent charge quoted by the (adjusted capitalized cost + residual) on the lease agreement.

The only Fees involved should be the Lease Acquisition Fee ($595), some minor Documentation Fees <$100 (I am using $80), and a small CA State Environmental/tire Fee <$20 (I am using $9). Licence and Registration (I am using $400 since the DMV calculator is not working). These can be either paid upfront or financed in the adjusted capitalized cost. I am calculating paid upfront, but it doesn't really matter since I am using a fixed $2500 "drive-off" and financing them would just mean a larger down payment which makes the net or adjusted capitalized cost the same (There is a slight advantage to paying for them upfront since you pay use tax on the CCR down payment)

The delta between Invoice and MSRP is $1,645 for a Base LT and $1,828 for a loaded Premier. The reserve credit is $200-$150 depending on whether the dealer is or isn't on GM Floor Plan. So dealer profit at MSRP without marking anything up is $1,845 to $2028. The profit on Rent Charge markup is 90%-70% depending on whether the dealer is or isn't on GM Floor Plan, so this seems to be where the dealer is making a "hidden" profit.

I am using $2,500 drive-off since that will be offset by the CA CVRP Rebate.

Bottom line:
Fair deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Base LT @ MSRP $36,620 (+$875 delivery) with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $382 per month. $15,886.26 Total of Payments
Great deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Base LT @ Invoice $35,155 (+$875 delivery) +$500 with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $352 per month. $14,825 Total of Payments

Fair deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on Loaded Premier @ MSRP $43,030 (+$875 delivery) with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $483 per month. $19,322.16 Total of Payments
Great deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Loaded Premier @ Invoice $41,202 (+$875 delivery) +$500 with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $439 per month. $17,861 Total of Payments

Now its off to see how little the dealers are willing to make. :mrgreen:

You come out a bit high. If you want, I can email you my spreadsheet and see if you can play around with it and give me feedback.
 
JupiterMoon said:
adamsocb said:
I believe I now have all of the data to know what a good Bolt Lease deal is. I just confirmed by reverse calculating this offer from Chevrolet.com that the Capital Cost Reduction rebate (CCR) is $2,500 and the "buy" Money Factor (what the bank charges) is 0.0005. If the money factor (Rent) is higher than this the dealer is making extra profit on the "Rent Charge"

The Residual reverse calculates to 60% so there is either a typo on the offer (should be 36,000 miles not 45,000, or GM Finance has increased the residual 2% more (not likely), I will assume a typo and continue to believe the GM Financial chart that has the 36 month Residual Values at LT 58%, 60%, & 61%; Premier 57%, 59%, & 60% for 45,000, 36,000, & 30,000 miles respectively.

For those that don't already know, you can calculate the Money Factor by dividing the monthly rent charge quoted by the (adjusted capitalized cost + residual) on the lease agreement.

The only Fees involved should be the Lease Acquisition Fee ($595), some minor Documentation Fees <$100 (I am using $80), and a small CA State Environmental/tire Fee <$20 (I am using $9). Licence and Registration (I am using $400 since the DMV calculator is not working). These can be either paid upfront or financed in the adjusted capitalized cost. I am calculating paid upfront, but it doesn't really matter since I am using a fixed $2500 "drive-off" and financing them would just mean a larger down payment which makes the net or adjusted capitalized cost the same (There is a slight advantage to paying for them upfront since you pay use tax on the CCR down payment)

The delta between Invoice and MSRP is $1,645 for a Base LT and $1,828 for a loaded Premier. The reserve credit is $200-$150 depending on whether the dealer is or isn't on GM Floor Plan. So dealer profit at MSRP without marking anything up is $1,845 to $2028. The profit on Rent Charge markup is 90%-70% depending on whether the dealer is or isn't on GM Floor Plan, so this seems to be where the dealer is making a "hidden" profit.

I am using $2,500 drive-off since that will be offset by the CA CVRP Rebate.

Bottom line:
Fair deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Base LT @ MSRP $36,620 (+$875 delivery) with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $382 per month. $15,886.26 Total of Payments
Great deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Base LT @ Invoice $35,155 (+$875 delivery) +$500 with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $352 per month. $14,825 Total of Payments

Fair deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on Loaded Premier @ MSRP $43,030 (+$875 delivery) with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $483 per month. $19,322.16 Total of Payments
Great deal for a 36 month 36,000 mile lease deal on a Loaded Premier @ Invoice $41,202 (+$875 delivery) +$500 with 8% sales tax is $2500 drive off and $439 per month. $17,861 Total of Payments

Now its off to see how little the dealers are willing to make. :mrgreen:

You come out a bit high. If you want, I can email you my spreadsheet and see if you can play around with it and give me feedback.

A very good general rule of thumb.

1) Every 1000 the MSRP is lowered, the payment changes by $15-16.
2) Every 1000 the Cap Cost is lowered the payment changes $30-31.
 
JupiterMoon said:
You come out a bit high. If you want, I can email you my spreadsheet and see if you can play around with it and give me feedback.

Could you upload your spreadsheet to google spreadsheet and post a URL ?
That way we can all learn from it
 
fromport said:
JupiterMoon said:
You come out a bit high. If you want, I can email you my spreadsheet and see if you can play around with it and give me feedback.

Could you upload your spreadsheet to google spreadsheet and post a URL ?
That way we can all learn from it

Ok very good. I'm fine tuning it a bit as soon as I am finished I'll do exactly that.
 
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Wu1M4pVKXxcGrKkl1ONe9oj7IJL3e9JEuo-ENiJgfaE/edit#gid=964577275

Here you guys go.

Just make sure when you receive an MSRP value from a dealer, to note if the MSRP given includes destination or not. There is a Yes/No tab to include/exclude it.

Let me know what you guys think. I've cross-referenced it with two other sites and it comes out exactly as it should.

Cheers.
 
JupiterMoon said:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Wu1M4pVKXxcGrKkl1ONe9oj7IJL3e9JEuo-ENiJgfaE/edit#gid=964577275

Here you guys go.

Just make sure when you receive an MSRP value from a dealer, to note if the MSRP given includes destination or not. There is a Yes/No tab to include/exclude it.

Let me know what you guys think. I've cross-referenced it with two other sites and it comes out exactly as it should.

Cheers.

*excellent*

Very informative, thanks a lot !
 
JupiterMoon said:
You come out a bit high. If you want, I can email you my spreadsheet and see if you can play around with it and give me feedback.

Thanks for the interest JupiterMoon. Where do you see it high?
I too have a detailed calculating spreadsheet and it matches my actual lease contract within $0.03 on the total of all payments. Monthly payment is a match to the penny and drive-off is within $0.01. It also matches using the GM Financial Dealer Workbook calculation sheet. As the sale price goes up and down the DMV fees will change by a few $$ but not enough to make much difference in the payment with a fixed $2,500 drive-off. In my sheet you have to adjust the "Buyer Down Payment" as other parameters change to keep the drive-off at $2,500. The math to work the "Buyer Down Payment" backwards from the desired drive-off or "due at signing" is not worth the effort for me. I will try your sheet as well and see if it matches my lease contract.

Here is a link to my calc sheet:
http://www.projectcba.com/2017_bolt/2017_bolt_ev_lease_calculator_loaded_premier_msrp.xlsx
 
JupiterMoon said:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Wu1M4pVKXxcGrKkl1ONe9oj7IJL3e9JEuo-ENiJgfaE/edit#gid=964577275

Here you guys go.

Just make sure when you receive an MSRP value from a dealer, to note if the MSRP given includes destination or not. There is a Yes/No tab to include/exclude it.

Let me know what you guys think. I've cross-referenced it with two other sites and it comes out exactly as it should.

Cheers.

I just ran it with your sheet and got exactly the same numbers as mine. Very cool the numbers are the same and I am confident these calculators are accurate!

Your Sheet with my numbers

I did notice that your sheet subtracts the $7,500 Federal Tax Credit from the "Adjusted Capital Cost" calculation. The GM Financial Bolt lease does not do this. Instead they inflate the residual (it would normally be less than 50% for 36 month, 36,000 miles) and they provide a $2,500 rebate (CCR). Also the wholesale Money Factor was 0.00072 as of January 17, 2017. It may have changed since then.
 
DorthyWilliams said:
Wow, thanks for sharing your calculations here. I think this should be more exciting for me as I am looking also to lease Bolt EV. I have found the calculations from DSR Leasing and they have just $279/month . I just want to know the difference of this calculations and in your calculations here. I don't know how to solve or calculate it on my own as I am just new in car leasing. What do you think about this listing?

So I saw this deal and this is what I can say about it given what they tell us:

ANN. MILES: 10000
PAYMENT: $279
CAPITAL REDUCTION: $2,999
REBATE: $2,500


This is an LT with no packages...which will be hard to find but let's say you do....

Residual: 61%
MF: .0005
Price Sold: (unknown) - but we can figure this out using Excel's goal seek.

Down-payment: $2999 (which INCLUDES drive off fees - make a note of that!).
Tax Rate: 8.75% (for where I'm at)

The results we get:

Price Sold then is: $36,651 (3.2% off MSRP)

Final Monthly Payment: $333.63 ($278.90 + $27.89 interest + $26.74 tax).

What goes towards the cap cost?

$2500 lease cash ( which is from the $7500 federal rebate they aren't giving you)
$1239.13 down-payment that you write a check for
$1759.87 drive off fees and taxes and first down

So $3739.13 goes towards cap cost reduction.

I hope this makes sense.
 
adamsocb said:
JupiterMoon said:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Wu1M4pVKXxcGrKkl1ONe9oj7IJL3e9JEuo-ENiJgfaE/edit#gid=964577275

Here you guys go.

Just make sure when you receive an MSRP value from a dealer, to note if the MSRP given includes destination or not. There is a Yes/No tab to include/exclude it.

Let me know what you guys think. I've cross-referenced it with two other sites and it comes out exactly as it should.

Cheers.

I just ran it with your sheet and got exactly the same numbers as mine. Very cool the numbers are the same and I am confident these calculators are accurate!

Your Sheet with my numbers

I did notice that your sheet subtracts the $7,500 Federal Tax Credit from the "Adjusted Capital Cost" calculation. The GM Financial Bolt lease does not do this. Instead they inflate the residual (it would normally be less than 50% for 36 month, 36,000 miles) and they provide a $2,500 rebate (CCR). Also the wholesale Money Factor was 0.00072 as of January 17, 2017. It may have changed since then.

Adam,

You can change that number in my spreadsheet to accurately reflect what they are offering at this particular time. This will drastically alter the payments as you'll see. Let me know if you need help in figuring out what's going on but from what it sounds like you've got it all figured out :)
 
Bumping this thread up cause I have a feeling there might be others who could find it as useful as I did. As I searched for a reasonable deal on our car yesterday, I found this thread one of the more useful ones especially adamsocb's original post. Thanks for the posts everyone.
I've posted this elsewhere on the 'How much did I pay' thread, but here is the deal I got yesterday (1/30/2017):

Bolt EV Premier +Infotainment +DriverConfidence Packages, DC Charging
Arctic Blue, Dark gray leather interior
MSRP: $43,510
CCR: -$3,739.32 ($2,500 rebate + further discounts)
Capitalized cost: $39,952.38
Miles/yr: 10000
Payment: $432.18 + tax = $470.00/month (LA County)
36 month lease
Residual = $26,106 (60%)
Due at signing: $2,500 (incl first month's payment, taxes, fees)

I'm sure others might be able to do better. I negotiated with 3-4 dealers till I got numbers I was happy enough with.
 
In the SF Bay Area, the best dealership I found is Dublin Chevrolet. They have $1600 off MSRP and their online correspondence is upfront and detailed. They have a few LT with fast charging options still available, I think. I backed off because I am cheap :p and wanted more discount than what is being offered. Came across impressed with their communication and never felt like they they would play games.
 
Back
Top