Do you think I'll be able to tow a small boat with the Bolt?

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ScooterCT said:
The Bolt was built in two years, or about five years faster than normal. They probably grabbed a fuse box from the corporate parts bin. Remember, vehicles from a maker share parts all the time. And the Bolt is built on a shared platform.

Tow away dude. You're obviously far more brilliant than all the design and product safety engineers at GM.

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Even if Chevrolet did grab a fuse box from the corporate parts bin, which is very unlikely since the Bolt was engineered from the ground up, the selection and labeling of the fuses in the fuse box is very specific to the Bolt EV. The Bolt is NOT built on a share platform, the Bolt was designed from the ground up and there is no other car in the GM family that currently uses the same platform as the Bolt. If you are continue to provide posts where you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about please don't provide any posts at all.
 
ScooterCT said:
Or don't do any of the above, because you're an incredibly irresponsible blockhead.
None of what you recommend has any bearing on the risks you'll face towing a trailer if you do it responsibly. If you get into an accident specifically because you happened to be towing a the trailer then it will be because you weren't driving safely with it, and therefore you'd be at fault anyway. And if you don't get into an accident then no cop is going to pull you over and cite you specifically for towing a trailer in defiance of the owner's manual.

Towing trailers is not the hallmark of a sociopath.
 
ScooterCT said:
2. Also, and this is for your protection, not mine. Call your state police. Read the statement from the manual. Then explain you intend to tow. And ask if they have a problem with that.

Yes, absolutely. The state police love calls like this. Be sure to ask for the Chief.
 
What about putting the boat on the roof rack? I know it's only technically rated for 100 lbs, but that's also probably VERY conservative. To my knowledge, they don't have roof rails yet anyway, so yeah. Don't give up on the dream.

I'm also not so sure about the towing thing. I know what the manual says, and a 175 lb boat is NOTHING. For all we know, the back of the car could be designed exclusively for crumpling rather than anything structural. The fact that people tow with i3s is terrifying to me, given the carbon fiber frame.

My opinion is that the car would be FINE towing your boat, as long as the framing back there is structural enough to support a proper trailer hitch. As for the brakes, GIMME A BREAK!! There are giant disk brakes on each wheel, PLUS regenerative braking in the front. People think NOTHING of towing campers on giant old pickups with nothing but crappy drum brakes. As for the motor, also, I wouldn't worry. We put hundreds of pounds of meat in the seats of the car and it's fine. We put a hundred pounds in the trunk and another hundred on the roof and it's fine. There's also only one speed in the transmission, so that bodes well for reliability too. I think that really the only thing is are the attachment points appropriate. I have to say, in looking at the underside of the car, it doesn't look any more flimsy than any other car I've seen people put trailers on. There's also a very convenient connector in the bumper that somebody probably makes a trailer light take-off for too, and very easy to connect and disconnect by hand. The big plastic bumper cover is a pain though, I have a hard time visualizing how the hitch would come out without hacking the bumper thing up.

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On the other hand, the manual statement might also be GM's way of saying
Stop being a candyass and buy a Silverado 3500HD to tow your little boat!
 

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I also want to point out some of the truly terrifying stuff that people do on the regular and get away with. NOT saying it's right, and definitely not saying it's a good idea, but I'm just saying...

terrifyingsaturntrailerhitch.jpg

If this is acceptable, then anybody with half a brain could do just as good a job on the Bolt.
 
Pigwich said:
The big plastic bumper cover is a pain though, I have a hard time visualizing how the hitch would come out without hacking the bumper thing up.

The installation instructions for the Curt trailer hitch for the Bolt EV show the trailer hitch mounted directly on the bumper bolts, https://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Hitch/Chevrolet/Bolt+EV/2017/C11457.html?vehicleid=201751562. The instructions also show cutting a 4" by 2-1/4" strip out of the lower fascia, the trim piece covering up the opening between the storage compartment and the bumper. Installation of the Curt trailer hitch for the Bolt EV looks very easy.
 
Pigwich said:
I also want to point out some of the truly terrifying stuff that people do on the regular and get away with. NOT saying it's right, and definitely not saying it's a good idea, but I'm just saying...

The Curt trailer hitch for the Bolt EV is a DOT Class I certified hitch specifically design for the Bolt EV. As long as this hitch is installed in accordance with the manufacturers instructions then the hitch installation also retains the DOT Class I certification. These are engineered trailer hitches specifically designed to be safe under the certified conditions.
 
https://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/problems/Equipment/towing/Towing.pdf

Suggest all the towing geniuses on this thread read the NHSTA towing guide at the link above. Notice the part that says "Check the owner’s manual and review the manufacturer’s guide to see if the vehicle you plan to buy can tow a trailer." Then read page 246 of your usual manual.

Then just ignore the NHSTA and GM, because, as we all know from this ridiculous thread, you're a towing genius.
 
:D Come on now, we all know what the manual says and we all know what the lawyers say, and we all know that you'd sue the guy who's car exploded in front of you and probably win, I think this horse has been beaten. Rest assured, everybody respects and had registered your opinion on the matter. And sure, while you may easily and rightfully make the argument that nobody knows better than the engineers at GM, nothing says their true (or our) opinions are reflected in the owners manual. In my experience, it's always easier to tell people NO and there's a lot less liability that way too. Which is good, right? After all, its a lot safer than trusting a third party to do something correctly, right? BUT, that doesn't rule out the ability of a third party to DO it right, does it? Because it sure looks like it could be done correctly, within reason, by somebody with brains and experience. Let's keep it technical and constructive.
 
I have done most of what SpewerCT suggests.

CA DMV has no opinion on the matter. They told me legally I can do whatever I want. If I break it, hey, it's mine to break.

CA Highway Patrol said they also don't care what I do as long as MINIMUM standards are met. The trailer has good tires, the trailer has good lights, the trailer has its own brakes if over 1000 pounds, safety chains are used as back-up to the ball hitch. They also said they don't care about what the tow vehicle is as long as it is poweful enough to keep up with the flow of traffic. They also basically said it's my vehicle to harm if I choose. THEY DON'T CARE.

Since I own three trailers, years ago I called about obtaining trailer insurance. SUCH A THING DOES NOT EXIST. The trailer is always covered with the same liability coverage as the towing vehicle. (Basically car + trailer = 1 vehicle)
I owned a smalish hybrid at the time. The owners manual said "Towing is not recommended". A lot of times this is a blanket statement. They worry you will be disappointed with performance when towing with an underpowered vehicle. At no place did it say "towing is illegal or dangerous with this car". (It does not say that in the Bolt manual either.) Hitches for the hybrid were commercially available from MULTIPLE WELL KNOWN VENDORS. I told my insurance company of my intentions and there were NO EXTRA PREMIUMS, FORMS, or anything special required.

In an accident, you can/will only be blamed for root cause. When trailering, it would need to be PROVEN that the size / weight of the trailer was the cause. Fat chance since the Bolt EV is quite powerful, has more braking ability than most cars, and is HEAVY for it's size due to all the batteries.

Pulling a trailer is not inherently scary, difficult, or dangerous. Particually in CA and a few other states, any vehicle combination with more than two axles is legally limited to 55 mph or less. Going a bit slower when towing is the #1 thing to consider along with allowing proportionally more stopping distance.

BUT FROM AN ENGINEERING AND SCIENTIFIC VIEWPOINT - towing a trailer of total weight 1000 pounds puts practically the same acceleration and braking demands on the car as putting five 200 pound people inside the car. So yes Virginia, if you pull a trailer, you should put less weight inside the car. Wind resistance makes it more difficult to accelerate but easier to brake, so lets call that net zero on wear & tear. Lets not nit pick about the resistance of the (probably two) extra tires.

A for the manual- there are dozens of errors and omissions, and I'm guessing multiple VERSIONS out there, and no doubt there will soon be REVISIONS.
I called a lawyer since SpewerCT said he isn't one so I can pass on some legal advice. The owner's manual is a GUIDELINE to be used for BASIC information and not legally binding.

As for talking to your dealer about towing. I'm still laughing out loud at that one. They SELL cars. They sometimes bolt stuff onto cars, replace tires, and do fluid changes. But they are only experts at SELLING cars. Asing your dealer about towing with the bolt is like asking the guy at Best Buy how a TV works. And I don't mean how to turn it on, or if you should turn it on. I mean how it works.

Step #1 - Talk to trailer and hitch companies about pulling with your Bolt. Explain the horsepower, torque, and gross vehicle weight. (The real experts)

Step #2 - Buy a professionally made hitch from a nationally recognized brand. Have it professionally installed. They might avoid a mistake you may make if you have never done this. Should not cost more than a $100. I've had it done for free if I bought the hitch from the same people - since normally it only takes 30 minutes or less and needs only a few tools.

Step #3. Start small, light, and slow. Tow a trailer EMPTY of contents first. See how the car behaves. Get comfortable with the empty trailer behind you.

Step #4 Add weight. Drive slower than normal. Do not exceed 55 mph. PRACTICE in ideal weather and daylight.

Step #5 Drive conservatively. Plan routes (and parking) that does not require backing up. A counter-intuitive aspect is, the SHORTER the trailer, the more difficult it is to keep going straight in reverse. My 22 foot trailer is a dream to back up compared to my 8 foot one. Semi drivers have it made with their 53 footers.

Step #6 have fun as your confidence grows if this is for recreation.

I'd be happy to chat with anyone with specific questions in PM. I really am a towing expert and own or have owned a wide variety of trailers and tow vehicles over the years. Zero accidents or incidents in 25 years and over 100,000 miles with a trailer behind me. I have towed a few hundred pounds up to 15 tons.

-John
 
We had to get specific separate insurance for our pop-up camping trailer. Our regular car insurance for the tow-vehicle wouldn't cover the trailer if there was some sort of accident involving it.
 
devbolt said:
We had to get specific separate insurance for our pop-up camping trailer. Our regular car insurance for the tow-vehicle wouldn't cover the trailer if there was some sort of accident involving it.

In BC, according to my local ICBC agent, trailer liability insurance is only for when the trailer becomes disconnected and is a vehicle of its 'own'. When attached to a tow vehicle, the liability of the tow vehicle covers the trailer as well. As for specific damage to the trailer, not sure.
 
BoltWanabee said:
The installation instructions for the Curt trailer hitch for the Bolt EV show the trailer hitch mounted directly on the bumper bolts, The instructions also show cutting a 4" by 2-1/4" strip out of the lower fascia, the trim piece covering up the opening between the storage compartment and the bumper. Installation of the Curt trailer hitch for the Bolt EV looks very easy.

Installation time is quoted at 40 minutes

613px-2017-chevrolet-bolt-curt-trailer-hitch-installation.JPG


It made it to the Wiki already:
http://www.electricvehiclewiki.com/Chevy_Bolt_Trailer_Hitch
 
Guys, I'm puzzled. A few posts ago, there's a picture of an aftermarket hitch for the Bolt. In big bold letters are the words: WARNING! Do not exceed vehicle manufacturer's gross towing capacity", or something like that. Which on the Bolt, if I read the manual correctly, is essentially zero pounds.

I find that big bold legal CYA note to be a real head-scratcher. Certainly the hitch manufacturer took the time to research the Bolt. Is there a place where the Bolt manual or other recent GM guidance gives a towing capacity? Or is it just a wink and a nod, as in "yea, we know what you're going to do with it, but we're putting this verbage here so you can't sue us". I mean, the minute you use their product, you're violating their clear instructions on how to safely use their product.

It seems very catch-22, unless there's a published towing capacity I missed in this thread.

You guys tow safely and be happy. Just asking out of curiosity.
 
I noticed tonight there is a "Chevrolet Customer Care" agent who joined last week, and has posted a few messages on other threads. This towing thread is clearly an ideal place for an official statement by GM Customer Care. This agent -probably- has a line of communications to Bolt Engineering and GM Legal. It'd be nice if they'd query those corporate resources and give towing advocates the official blessing of GM. Or not. But at least clarify the situation from GM's perspective.
 
ScooterCT said:
I noticed tonight there is a "Chevrolet Customer Care" agent who joined last week, and has posted a few messages on other threads. This towing thread is clearly an ideal place for an official statement by GM Customer Care.
I really don't think you're going to get anything out of a GM employee other than the standard towing disclaimer.
 
I'm not an engineer or a lawyer, but I am a mech. tech. and I do have quite a bit of experience towing with a small FWD car. I've got a MK1 Ford focus (suspension and brakes upgraded to SVT versions) that I've used to haul my 4x8' utility trailer for a few years now. Car is rated to tow a max of 1000lbs which is pretty standard for a small car. The factors for that tow rating are braking capacity, and importantly how much tongue weight can the receivers mounting points in the chassis and rear suspension handle. And how much weight can the whole system handle without becoming unstable at speed. In order for the trailer to be stable at speed a certain percentage of its weight needs to sit on the tongue rather than over the trailers axle. Not enough weight on the tongue and the trailer could turn into a pendulum if you go too fast. I can tell you that I've easily doubled the rated capacity of the car without any trouble, by keeping the tongue weight down (under the recommended 100lbs) and keeping the speed down, both to prevent the trailer from becoming unstable and to accommodate much increased stopping distances. As others have said, Europeans tow quite successfully with small cars all the time.

Now getting back to the Bolt, the weight of the car will contribute to the stability of the overall system (car and trailer), and the torquey motor combined with regenerative breaking to assist the ample friction brakes make for an ideal tow vehicle on paper. My concern however comes from the cooling capacity of the motor, speed controller, and battery. Accelerating and decelerating another 1000+ lbs will require those components to work harder for longer than they normally would and I would be concerned about heat buildup issues. Higher temps equal reduced life.

With anything there have to be some safety margins built in to the power train, and if the car has seating for five it's not unreasonable to some that someone could stuff five small to med bodies in the car and drive around California on a hot day, the cooling system should be able to cope with that load. So if we assume four extra occupants at 150 lbs each (conservative) that's an extra 600lbs you're hauling around which should definitely not cause a warranty issue.

Getting back to your 175lb boat, even if it's on a 150lb trailer that's only 350ish lbs total. If the weight is distributed properly on the trailer the tongue the receiver will only be seeing 35lbs or so which is nothing. You'll barely even feel that back there, accelerating and decelerating at lower speeds will be easy, and the system should be perfectly stable up to probably the max speed of the trailer around 45-50mph. With that load you are definetlt not going to have a catastrophe like the receiver tearing away from the car, and the friction brakes will not just stop working. So no safety problems, worst case would be driveline damage due to increased load. But getting back to comparing the weight of passengers to your trailer I really can't see it being a problem. Would it give GM an excuse to void your warranty if you tow with it? Maybe... But that would be about the worst consequence of what you're proposing. Take it easy, don't try to do crazy highway speeds with it, don't be an idiot, you'll be fine.

When I lose my focus to take delivery of the Bolt I'm going to have to shift towing duties over to our Jetta, which despite having twice the rated tow capacity will actually be a worse car to tow with. I'm going to be eagerly watching the developments with tow ratings of the Ampera E when it's released. I would not at all be supposed surprised to see that is rated for at least 1000lbs in Europe. At that point I'll be putting my trailer behind my Bolt for sure.
 
ScooterCT said:
ROTFL at both the original question, and several of the answers.

The Bolt, like any other subcompact, is so totally unqualified to tow a boat (well, maybe a canoe), that it's an insanely laughable concept. Brakes: totally inadequate. Frame: totally inadequate. Suspension: totally inadequate. Tires: Totally inadequate.

But maybe you should give it a try anyway. Be sure to film the results for us.

OP said "175 pound boat." Not a yacht. :)
 
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