Winter Tires & Wheels

Here's a tip that might be useful: With my snow tires mounted on my original wheels (because the wheels I ordered for the snows haven't come in yet) I have the unmounted summer tires lying around. I threw one of them into the lower cargo compartment. They fit down there just fine with the false floor on top, even though they won't fit when mounted on a wheel and inflated.

The reason I did this is because I haven't figured out exactly what I'm going to do about carrying a spare tire yet, and I've seen several posts complaining about the length of time it takes tire shops (and even dealers) to get a replacement tire. And because some shops claim that the self-seal tires aren't repairable (which is BS). So I figure if I suffer some tire damage that can't be quickly fixed, at least I can get towed to a shop shop that will be able to mount the summer tire so I can be on my way without being stranded somewhere, waiting for the right tire to show up.

Hi Oilerlord...thank you for the advice

Have you tried a mounted tire that is only inflated to 12 psi or so?

LeftieBiker said:

Have you tried a mounted tire that is only inflated to 12 psi or so?

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No. When I get the set of wheels I've ordered I'll get the summer tires mounted on them and give that a try. I'm keeping my finger crossed - if that fits then it will solve my spare tire conundrum.

I got a price for winter tires on steel wheels - Nokian Hakka R2 195 width in a taller aspect, on 15" wheels, with cloned sensors (which cost more initially, but don't need to be reset each time you swap them) - for about $1170. Expensive, but a lot less so than staying with the stock size tire. The tires alone are about $300 more, and 17" steel wheels are also more expensive.

Hakka R2 195 15 are about $115 each
Steel 15" wheels are $55 each + shipping
Cloned sensors are $75 each (vs $40 for 3rd party, or about $125 each for stock)

Narrower tires are better in the snow, as are taller tires better traction than lower profile.

NeilBlanchard said:

Narrower tires are better in the snow, as are taller tires better traction than lower profile.

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My father always said that narrower tires were better in deep snow, but wider tires were better on ice and packed snow. I believe the logic is larger surface area provides more friction on the more slippery ice and packed snow giving wider tires an advantage over narrow tires in those conditions. Whereas in deep snow narrow tires can more easily penetrate the snow for more concentrated traction while wider tires would more easily "float" reducing traction. Kind of like wider skiis in powder...

So it really depends on how often the snow is deep as to whether narrow tires are better.

SeanNelson said:

LeftieBiker said:

Have you tried a mounted tire that is only inflated to 12 psi or so?

Click to expand...

No. When I get the set of wheels I've ordered I'll get the summer tires mounted on them and give that a try. I'm keeping my finger crossed - if that fits then it will solve my spare tire conundrum.

Click to expand...

Here's an update on this: I got my wheels, had the summer tires mounted on them, and tried again to wrangle one of them into the lower cargo compartment (the compartment underneath the "false floor" and above the round well with the foam insert). Much to my surprise and delight, it fit, fully inflated!

It's a tight fit, and I think the reason I had problems before was that I tried to put the tire in with the leading edge (the one closest to the front of the car) first. What you have to do is to lower the back seats, fit the trailing edge of the tire/wheel down and into the back first (the part closest to the rear bumper), and then the leading edge will drop into place. It looks like you might not be able to raise the rear seat backs again, but they actually come up just fine, and the false floor fits in place on top. In fact, with the tire and wheel underneath you have zero worries about the false floor being able to support a heavy load.

So that solves my spare tire worries. And there's a fair bit of space inside and beside the tire to hold the jack, tools, charger, and whatever other equipment you want to carry without having it clutter up the cargo compartment above.

Just realized there is an advantage to driving a 90-mile EV without fast charging - I'll always be within the 100 mile AAA radius for a free tow home. No need to haul around a heavy spare tire and jack. That's so 1970's. Chalk one up for compliance cars.

BoltMaybe said:

NeilBlanchard said:

Narrower tires are better in the snow, as are taller tires better traction than lower profile.

Click to expand...

My father always said that narrower tires were better in deep snow, but wider tires were better on ice and packed snow. I believe the logic is larger surface area provides more friction on the more slippery ice and packed snow giving wider tires an advantage over narrow tires in those conditions. Whereas in deep snow narrow tires can more easily penetrate the snow for more concentrated traction while wider tires would more easily "float" reducing traction. Kind of like wider skiis in powder...

So it really depends on how often the snow is deep as to whether narrow tires are better.

Click to expand...

With winter tires, they have two things that let them work far better: they have compounds that stay flexible in cooler temperatures, and more importantly, they have sipes that massively increase the traction / surface area. Sipes are designed to open up under acceleration / braking to multiply the number of edges that provide grip on ice and snow. But sipes are designed to stay "locked" together under cornering, so they keep more traction on dry pavement.

Taller sidewalls also help keep the tread in contact with the snow.

I just saw in another tire topic that one of the recommended winter tire sizes is 195 65 R15. We actually have a set of General Arctic snows in that size that I was about to give away. Does anyone here know how well 15" wheels and snows actually work on the Bolt? How about a price for just the wheels and TPMS sensors from a place like Tire Rack?

(As things look bad for the Federal tax credit, I'm about to put a small deposit on a loaded Premiere, to hold it for 2 weeks.)

oilerlord said:

Just realized there is an advantage to driving a 90-mile EV without fast charging - I'll always be within the 100 mile AAA radius for a free tow home. No need to haul around a heavy spare tire and jack. That's so 1970's. Chalk one up for compliance cars.

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I dunno - if you take that logic to its extreme then you'd just end up staying home in order to avoid all car-related issues...

I went down to 16" wheels, just because the 15" tires were a little harder to get in a 65 sidewall profile. I ended up going with 195/60 16 Bridgestone Blizzak WS 80s. The theoretical reduction in sidewall height and ground clearance (approx. 4mm) is not noticeable and easily offset with a slight increase in pressure; unfortunately the Blizzaks aren't available in a 65 profile at 195 wide on a 16" rim (but I can confirm there's plenty of space in the wheel well to fit this slight increase in tire total diameter if your favourite tires are available in this size). I can take some pictures and upload if people want to see how they look fitted.

The sensors were $50 each from Chevy (part # 19332370), as my local tire shop was struggling to get aftermarket sensors. The Chevy dealer said they would have sold them at $40 each if I'd also got the wheels/tires from them, but I'd already ordered the tires ($1081CAD including tax (fitted) for the wheel/tire package) as the snow started early November here in Ontario. It was also $15 at the dealer for them to pair the sensors to the car once they were fitted. Just for interest, the total fitted cost for the wheel/tire package was almost identical to the cost for just the winter tires in the stock (215/50 17) size, and the 195 tires alone are much cheaper, so I'll easily recoup the $200 CAD that the sensors cost over the next few sets of winter tires when these wear out.

I can confirm the car will run fine without TPMS, as I ran it around for a couple of weeks without the sensors paired to the car, until I could get back to the dealer.

My concerns over the car operating when its gets really cold are now gone too. We've had sustained temperatures below -28 (Celsius) for the last couple of weeks (that's the high temperature for the day) and the car works fine, even when left outside (I normally have it in a semi heated (around -5 Celsius) garage overnight, but have been leaving it outside, just to see how it copes). It reduces the power output until the coolant circuit warms up, but it still outputs up to 60kW from the motor which doesn't slow it down too much (in fact I had to push it harder than I normally would in those conditions just to see what it had limited the motor's output too!!). It also restricts the regen until coolant circuits have warmed up too, but it still lets you run full regen in 'L' mode once the circuits have warmed up. I find the limited slip is coping better than I expected it would with regeneration on the icy roads too.

Just wondering what others might think about the following statements in the manual. Is there some legitimacy, or is GM mostly attempting to increase profit?

Page 284: "If the vehicle tires must be replaced with a tire that does not have a TPC Spec number, make sure they are the same size,
load range, speed rating, and construction (radial) as the original tires. Vehicles that have a tire pressure monitoring system could give an inaccurate low-pressure warning if non-TPC Spec rated tires are installed."

Pages 284-285: "If wheels or tires are installed that are a different size than the original equipment wheels and tires, vehicle performance, including its braking, ride and handling characteristics, stability, and resistance to rollover may be affected. If the vehicle has electronic systems such as antilock brakes, rollover airbags, traction control, electronic stability control, or All-Wheel Drive, the performance of these systems can also be affected."

This is followed by: "Warning - If different sized wheels are used, there may not be an acceptable level of performance and safety if tires not recommended for those wheels are selected. This increases the chance of a crash and serious injury. Only use GM specific wheel and tire systems developed for the vehicle, and have them properly installed by a GM certified technician."

Another section even warns against installing used rims.

I assume the following statement should be heeded: "Warning - Using bias-ply tires on the vehicle may cause the wheel rim flanges to develop cracks after many miles of driving. A tire and/or wheel could fail suddenly and cause a crash. Use only radial-ply tires with the wheels on the vehicle."

Reads to me more like GM is trying to protect themselves from liability. Sadly, we live in a litigious society; people will sue over anything.

You may well be right and if so, we'd at least have more choice buying tires and rims! GM parts can be quite pricey. But could not following their recommendations also affect warranty coverage?

WS7 said:

You may well be right and if so, we'd at least have more choice buying tires and rims! GM parts can be quite pricey. But could not following their recommendations also affect warranty coverage?

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It will only affect the warranty if it can be shown that whatever issue you're seeking a warranty repair for is due to the "unapproved" tires and/or wheels. If, for example, the battery dies on you, it's going to be pretty hard to pin the blame on the tires.

WS7 said:

You may well be right and if so, we'd at least have more choice buying tires and rims! GM parts can be quite pricey. But could not following their recommendations also affect warranty coverage?

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Manufacturers are usually quite specific as to what size wheel / tire combinations that are safe for their cars. As long as you go with recommendations listed on inside of your driver's door, warranty coverage will not be an issue regardless of the brand of wheels & tires you install on the vehicle. If you however choose to deviate from those recommendations, you do so at your own risk.

I don't think you can even buy a bias-ply tire anymore, but rest assured there is probably someone out there with a bald, mismatched set of bias-ply tires from the 70's that they feel are perfectly safe to run on their Bolt. I think the disclaimer statement in the owner's manual is written to protect GM and the rest of us from the stupid.

Thanks for the responses. I expect to have a Bolt by the spring and will be purchasing extra rims for snows, though likely not through my dealership. I was also planning to change/rotate tires at home, but if I want TPMS to continue working, the dealership will still have to match the sensor codes to their new positions. Will have to buy the sensors from GM I suppose. I'd buy the TPMS relearn tool, but GM sells it for $968 Canadian!

WS7 said:

I was also planning to change/rotate tires at home, but if I want TPMS to continue working, the dealership will still have to match the sensor codes to their new positions. Will have to buy the sensors from GM I suppose. I'd buy the TPMS relearn tool, but GM sells it for $968 Canadian!

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You should be able to use aftermarket sensors. Tire rack sells them:

https://www.tirerack.com/tpms/results.jsp?autoMake=Chevrolet&autoModel=Bolt+EV&autoYear=2017

I'd bet Costco sells & installs them too.

oilerlord said:

You should be able to use aftermarket sensors.

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Just a general note on aftermarket sensors - some of them need to be configured for use with a particular car using a special tool. This is a separate, one-time step that needs to be done before you use them for the first time and is in addition to the TPMS relearn procedure that uses a different tool. It's because some sensors are generic and need to be programmed to be compatible with cars from the particular manufacturer (GM, Ford, etc.).

If you get a sensor that's specifically designed for use with GM cars then you shouldn't need to do that step and the only extra work is the normal TPMS relearn procedure that's required each time you put a different wheel/tire onto the car.