JimFallstonMd
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:52 am
Location: Fallston Md.

11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Mon May 07, 2018 5:01 pm

2017 Cajun Red Bolt LT EV 7/3/17
DC Fast, Comfort & Confidence.
2016 Heather Gray Metallic Volt LT
Light Ash Leather, Comfort Package
GU125068 Bought 11/23/2015

SparkEVPilot
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:42 am
Location: Manteca, California

Re: 11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Tue May 08, 2018 12:59 am

JimFallstonMd wrote:http://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/autos-hybrids/11-reasons-people-dont-buy-electric-cars-and-why-theyre-wrong/ss-AAvWZwY?li=BBnb7Kz#image=1

Saw this on MSN today.

RANGE ANXIETY:
I have been driving Spark EVs for three years and have figured out where I can and cannot drive comfortably without going into a "range remaining" panic mode. Note here: My wife and I did drive our 2015 Spark EV from our home in Manteca, CA to South Lake Tahoe and back but we had quick charging available along the way. Same for driving to Fresno and back. I can now even make it to Bakersfield, CA and back.

For local, in-town, driving, an EV cannot be beat! But, if you want to drive long distance and/or into areas where quick charging is not available, you cannot easily go there without the possibility of being stranded or forced to use the slow L1 EVSE that came with the vehicle. Longer range EVs do make it possible to drive further from your home base as long as you stay on major traffic routes. But venture off of those routes and you may more often than not run into situations where there is no quick charging [QC] available to allow you to reach your destination in a reasonable amount of time and, possibly, not at all.

Fortunately for most drivers, about 85% of their driving is done locally and EVs excel in this area. But, It is that other 15% that can be a challenge. My solution is easy. Rather than have an expensive ICE sitting in my driveway, I choose to rent an ICE for those long trips and use the EV for all around-town driving. I just completed a 2100 mile trip, through California, Nevada and Utah and back, in a rented Nissan Altima. The trip would have been impossible in my Spark EV and there were a number of sections where even a Bolt EV would have choked. The Nissan Altima achieved 42.5 mpg for the entire trip.

This works for me and probably will work for many other potential or current EV drivers too. To those of you on the "should I buy an EV" fence, look for a nice clean used EV at a reasonable price and in good condition, buy it, and experiment. Just make sure it has the QC option. I leased my first Spark EV and, after I figured out it's limits, I bought a used 2014 Spark EV without the QC option and two years later purchased a used 2016 Spark EV that did have the QC option. The leased Spark EV goes back to the dealer next week but I still have the 2014 and 2016. They both are working great and I really enjoy driving past high-priced gasoline stations.

Evoforce
Posts: 53
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:21 am
Location: AZ

Re: 11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Tue May 08, 2018 8:42 am

Um... Get a 200 plus mile EV. It does wonders compared to a 150 mi or less. No need for ICE especially with a Tesla. CCS still needs to catch up to make it easier for Bolt but Bolt is still vastly better than the 150 mi or less crowd.

WetEV
Moderator
Posts: 352
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2016 1:26 pm
Location: Near Seattle

Re: 11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Tue May 08, 2018 12:56 pm

Evoforce wrote:Um... Get a 200 plus mile EV. It does wonders compared to a 150 mi or less. No need for ICE especially with a Tesla. CCS still needs to catch up to make it easier for Bolt but Bolt is still vastly better than the 150 mi or less crowd.


For reasonable commuting, you don't need 200 mile plus range. Sure, those few people with 150 mile round trip commutes need even more than 200 mile range

For the median commute of 20 miles, just about any modern EV should be a joy and a pleasure.
#49 on the LEAF 100 mile club.
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
2012 Leaf SL Red
2014 Leaf SL Red
Can't sit in a Bolt seat, hoping for better soon.
Or perhaps a Buick version? Buick Electra 225???

SparkEVPilot
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:42 am
Location: Manteca, California

Re: 11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Tue May 08, 2018 2:01 pm

Evoforce wrote:Um... Get a 200 plus mile EV. It does wonders compared to a 150 mi or less. No need for ICE especially with a Tesla. CCS still needs to catch up to make it easier for Bolt but Bolt is still vastly better than the 150 mi or less crowd.

Tesla's charging network is great but there are still many unreachable locations off of the major routes that even a Tesla cannot reach comfortably. What a difference it would make if every gas station - especially those with mini-marts - had two or more QC stations. Then you would only have to worry about how much extra time you would have to add to your trip for charging time.

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1057
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 5:25 pm
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: 11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Tue May 08, 2018 2:05 pm

Sure, for commuting. But most people use their cars for more than that.

Last weekend I went hiking about 200 miles away. I drove 180 miles to a DCQC in Bennington VT, and topped off at a DCQC while enjoying dinner in town. After the hike, I drove home. The only EV that could have made the trip, other than my Bolt, would be a Tesla. A 200+ mile EV.

Threads like this are always full of statistics. 85% of trips... 90% of people... Etc, etc. Car purchases aren't purely rational decisions. People do look at the other 15% of their trips, and see that an EV won't fit. So they'll buy something else. With any luck, they'll go with a PHEV so the other 85% can still be electric.

We need to start showing the world that EVs can work for 100% of your trips. IMO, that requires a minimum of 200 mile range, and 100kW charging. The Bolt isn't quite there. Only Tesla is. At that point, it's not about the car at all - it's about the infrastructure.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier

SparkEVPilot
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:42 am
Location: Manteca, California

Re: 11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Tue May 08, 2018 2:18 pm

WetEV wrote:
Evoforce wrote:Um... Get a 200 plus mile EV. It does wonders compared to a 150 mi or less. No need for ICE especially with a Tesla. CCS still needs to catch up to make it easier for Bolt but Bolt is still vastly better than the 150 mi or less crowd.


For reasonable commuting, you don't need 200 mile plus range. Sure, those few people with 150 mile round trip commutes need even more than 200 mile range

For the median commute of 20 miles, just about any modern EV should be a joy and a pleasure.

I agree completely! EVs like the Spark EV and Leaf EV are great for all of those short commutes and there are many nice used ones available that can be purchased at a reasonable cost. Nissan even sells replacement battery packs for some of their Leaf EV models. Just find a nice used Leaf and, if needed, replace the battery pack (be sure to check first) and you have an almost new EV for a much lower price than new.

The one thing I have yet to see posted is the impact regular charging a Chevy Bolt at home has on the owner's monthly electrical bill.

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1057
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 5:25 pm
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: 11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Tue May 08, 2018 2:57 pm

SparkEVPilot wrote:The one thing I have yet to see posted is the impact regular charging a Chevy Bolt at home has on the owner's monthly electrical bill.


If you pilot a spark EV, you should know the answer to this. The two cars' efficiency are close enough that commuting is roughly the same cost. And we know that most people don't take a lot of longer trips, the Bolt just allows them to do it electrically instead of burning gasoline. So add maybe 20% to the increase in your own bill and there you have it.

Or if you really want my numbers:

I drive my Bolt, on average, about 1,000 miles/month.
My Bolt gets, on average, about 3 miles for every kWh I pull from the wall (averaged over a year, so this includes winter driving at 2mpk and summer driving at 4mpk).
I pay $0.12/kWh

Therefore the Bolt adds about $40 to my monthly electric bill.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier

SparkEVPilot
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:42 am
Location: Manteca, California

Re: 11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Tue May 08, 2018 6:54 pm

GetOffYourGas wrote:
SparkEVPilot wrote:The one thing I have yet to see posted is the impact regular charging a Chevy Bolt at home has on the owner's monthly electrical bill.


If you pilot a spark EV, you should know the answer to this. The two cars' efficiency are close enough that commuting is roughly the same cost. And we know that most people don't take a lot of longer trips, the Bolt just allows them to do it electrically instead of burning gasoline. So add maybe 20% to the increase in your own bill and there you have it.

Or if you really want my numbers:

I drive my Bolt, on average, about 1,000 miles/month.
My Bolt gets, on average, about 3 miles for every kWh I pull from the wall (averaged over a year, so this includes winter driving at 2mpk and summer driving at 4mpk).
I pay $0.12/kWh

Therefore the Bolt adds about $40 to my monthly electric bill.

Thanks for your input. I would like to see what other EV owners experience too.

Here in Central California, PG&E is the main provider of electricity. My current plan is E-1 which is not a TOU plan but does have 3 tiers depending on usage quantity. T1 = $0.21, T2 = $0.28 and T3 = $0.43. PG&E also has an EV TOU plan with different rates for the time of day the power is consumed. Peak = $0.32, Part Peak = $0.20, Off Peak = $0.13. I have an MS Excel spreadsheet set up to compare both rate plans using hourly usage data for my home. The hourly data is available online from PG&E.

If I had a Chevy Bolt, I would probably switch to the EV TOU plan and charge only during the Off-Peak period. This would require installation of a 6.6 kWh L2 EVSE to make sure the car could be fully charged during the Off-Peak hours. Doing that would allow the power generated by my roof solar system to be used to cover my daily home power usage plus most of my AC usage during hot weather. My nearest DCFC location is 10 miles South of my home.

One additional note. My current L2 EVSE is about 85% efficient. That would make my current wall-to-wheels Spark EV efficiency about 5.1 mi / kWh. This will drop a bit at different periods throughout the year due to AC and heater usage as required to stay comfortable.

User avatar
Arob216
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2018 6:46 pm
Location: Colorado

Re: 11 Reasons why people don't buy EV's and why they are wrong

Wed May 16, 2018 11:51 pm

Evoforce wrote:The one thing I have yet to see posted is the impact regular charging a Chevy Bolt at home has on the owner's monthly electrical bill.

I drive ~30k miles per year, and pay .10828/kWh on flat rate. My expectation assuming avg efficiency remains around 4 mi/kWh on average is that it will be costing me about $67/month to charge the Bolt.

Previous car was Fusion Hybrid, i paid $120 or so per month for gas.

My utility company is now offering time of day rates with off-peak as low as .06733/kWh. It is so new that they offered to put a new meter on my house and test use for a month. If TOD service will benefit me, my monthly charging costs could drop to around $42/Month.

If my employer decided to take advantage of the tax incentives for commercial building owners and drop a few L2 chargers on the lot, my costs would go down considerably. With 2 Model 3s, 3 Bolts, a couple Leafs. and a few PHEVs already at the site, the demand is there. But, the building is only about 50% occupied so they are probably pinching costs until the rest of the building is leased.
2018 Chevy Bolt Premiere, Nightfall Gray

Return to “General / Main Chevy Bolt Owners Forum”