Article on heavy Bolt discounting ($5,000 off in CA)

[Anonymous]

I bought the one Bolt Premier at Harbor Chevrolet for over $4000 off MSRP. What is interesting is that when I showed up, they gave me another $1000 off in a new rebate I didn't even know about. My car doesn't have the fast charger, which I know is a must for many potential buyers. I just know that we never used it on our Leaf, and we have 4 other gas and gas/hybrid cars at our disposal for any long road trips. My brother has a Tesla Model S, and he never uses the superchargers either. Any way you slice it, if I'm driving from San Diego to San Francisco, I get there MUCH faster driving one of my gassers.

Anyways, with the discount and the rebate, I was under $5000 off MSRP. I paid $3000 upfront, and my payment is $330/month including tax for 15,000 miles per year.

Sounds like this was a lease, not a purchase. In the case of a lease, isn't "$5000 off MSRP" rather misleading? Does all of that "discount" come from the $7500 tax credit the lessor takes?

 

[schan2464]

Yes, it was a lease. My paperwork shows that the agreed upon price was $38,995, with a capital cost reduction of $6500. I put $3000 down, which leaves $3500. I believe this $3500 consists of $2500 (my portion of the $7500 tax credit), and an additional $1000 rebate. Edmunds shows a bonus cash of $2250 on the car as of April 1, so perhaps I could have received even more off than I did? In any case, it looks like the sticker price on the car as $43,155, but the price my lease is based off of was $38,995 ($4160 off). I really don't know where this extra $1000 beyond the $2500 tax credit came from. In any case, at $330/month including tax for a 15,000 mile/year lease on a Premier, I feel like this was a fair deal. A couple of months ago when I first started looking, I couldn't even find a LT model leasing for less than $380 month, if not $400.

 

[ScooterCT]

Leases make my head spin. The only thing I know for sure about leases is that I love people who lease expensive cars, because then I can buy them three years later at low mileage for half the cost of new.

 

[michael]

Yes, it was a lease. My paperwork shows that the agreed upon price was $38,995, with a capital cost reduction of $6500. I put $3000 down, which leaves $3500. I believe this $3500 consists of $2500 (my portion of the $7500 tax credit), and an additional $1000 rebate. Edmunds shows a bonus cash of $2250 on the car as of April 1, so perhaps I could have received even more off than I did? In any case, it looks like the sticker price on the car as $43,155, but the price my lease is based off of was $38,995 ($4160 off). I really don't know where this extra $1000 beyond the $2500 tax credit came from. In any case, at $330/month including tax for a 15,000 mile/year lease on a Premier, I feel like this was a fair deal. A couple of months ago when I first started looking, I couldn't even find a LT model leasing for less than $380 month, if not $400.

A key point is you got $4160 off sticker. I think that's pretty good. That should set a benchmark for the rest of us.

Harbor's web site typically shows about $2500 off sticker, so I think you got them to com down and additional $1600 or so. Good job!

 

[michael]

Leases make my head spin. The only thing I know for sure about leases is that I love people who lease expensive cars, because then I can buy them three years later at low mileage for half the cost of new.

Well in general that's true, but you can't buy a three year old Bolt coming off lease. Unless you want to wait a few years, you don't have that option.

I bought a three year old BMW off lease and that was a great deal, as you say. This situation is different.

 

[schan2464]

Yes, it was a lease. My paperwork shows that the agreed upon price was $38,995, with a capital cost reduction of $6500. I put $3000 down, which leaves $3500. I believe this $3500 consists of $2500 (my portion of the $7500 tax credit), and an additional $1000 rebate. Edmunds shows a bonus cash of $2250 on the car as of April 1, so perhaps I could have received even more off than I did? In any case, it looks like the sticker price on the car as $43,155, but the price my lease is based off of was $38,995 ($4160 off). I really don't know where this extra $1000 beyond the $2500 tax credit came from. In any case, at $330/month including tax for a 15,000 mile/year lease on a Premier, I feel like this was a fair deal. A couple of months ago when I first started looking, I couldn't even find a LT model leasing for less than $380 month, if not $400.

A key point is you got $4160 off sticker. I think that's pretty good. That should set a benchmark for the rest of us.

Harbor's web site typically shows about $2500 off sticker, so I think you got them to com down and additional $1600 or so. Good job!

This one was on their website at $4160 off as well. I think the combination of Orange and no fast charger made it less desirable to many, but it was exactly what we wanted.

 

[michael]

The Rydell web site is now showing $3500 factory rebate too!


And incidentally, guys, we need to make sure that this apparent increase in the rebate didn't come at the cost of a corresponding decrease in residual. If so the payments aren't affected significantly. This could merely be a response to the people who are grousing about GM or the dealer "keeping $5000" of the $7500. If all other things are equal, lease payments should go down by about $30/month

 

[SparkE]

If one is leasing, the amount that is most important is how much, total, the lessee will have paid at the end of the lease upon returning the vehicle. MSRP, monthly payments, down payment, rebates, incentives, etc. all have an effect on total cost, but the cost # is the most important single number. The others are all 'hand waving' that the car dealer magician uses to distract you while getting you to sign the piece of paper (and hiding money you will have to pay in other areas that he *isn't* talking to you about).

 

[sgt1372]

If one is leasing, the amount that is most important is how much, total, the lessee will have paid at the end of the lease . . .

Agreed. All the other mumbo jumbo is irrelevant to the total out of pocket expense over the full lease term.

I'd also add that, in order to make fair comparisons, only the monthly rent before sales tax should be used because almost everyone's sales tax rate is different and some don't even have to pay sales tax on lease payments.

Based on this, my total lease cost including the monthly payment of $282 over 36 months plus the $5k trade-in down payment minus $3k in rebates will be $12,152 on a $38k LT.

Of course, it's the rebates that made the deal better but that was part of the package. Those who don't get such rebates (like all of those Tesla M3 reservation holders who may never see a tax credit or a rebate due to a lapse of time) would not do as well.

So, let's compare apples to apples. Has any one gotten a better deal than mine here yet? If so, I (and I'm sure others) would like to hear about it.

 

[michael]

As far as I can tell Schan2464's deal is the best I've heard of. He is paying $410 a month including California tax on a Premier, 15K miles, total cost divided by 36.

4160 off MSRP and 3500 incentives.

Any dealer want to match it, I'm in...PM me

Premier, Silver Ice, Dark interior, DCFC nothing else

 

[sgt1372]

As far as I can tell Schan2464's deal is the best I've heard of. He is paying $410 a month including California tax on a Premier, 15K miles, total cost divided by 36. 4160 off MSRP and 3500 incentives.

Any dealer want to match it, I'm in...PM me

Premier, Silver Ice, Dark interior, DCFC nothing else

Sorry but you are not listening. The MSRP discount and "incentives" don't matter. Only the TOTAL LEASE COST matters for purposes of comparison.

Just based on the monthly lease rental and assuming a 36 month lease and a 8.5% sales tax rate, his total lease cost is $13,604, the deal is still more expensive than mine. How much did he pay up front and how much in rebates did he get? You need to factor those numbers in too before you can make a proper comparison.

Also FWIW, my monthly lease payment is only $305 a month (including tax). That's $105/mo less than the deal you quoted. So, even on those terms, I don't see how that's a better deal than mine.

 

[michael]

No, really I'm listening and I understand

Your cost is lower, absolutely, but it's not on the car I want (LT vs Premier)

His DEAL is the best one I've heard of since it's on a car quite similar to the one I want.

I can't even begin to evaluate your deal because it involved a trade in....apparently they gave you $5K allowance...was that generous/fair/unfair? I have no idea. Maybe your trade-in was worth $10K and they screwed you? Maybe it was worth $1K and you screwed them? I have no idea...

 

[sgt1372]

No, really I'm listening and I understand

Your cost is lower, absolutely, but it's not on the car I want (LT vs Premier)

His DEAL is the best one I've heard of since it's on a car quite similar to the one I want.

I can't even begin to evaluate your deal because it involved a trade in....apparently they gave you $5K allowance...was that generous/fair/unfair? I have no idea. Maybe your trade-in was worth $10K and they screwed you? Maybe it was worth $1K and you screwed them? I have no idea...

Never mind. You obviously don't get it. The trade in was the same as money. It was $5k out of pocket either way.

 

[michael]

A trade in isn't the same as money. Money has a definite value. A trade in has a range of possible values and the parties agree on one.

What did you trade in? What can he resell it for? If he allowed you $5K but knew (hypothetically) that he could re-sell the car for $8K at auction, then you paid $3k more than you thought you did.

If, again hypothetically, you could have sold the car private party for $8K, then it was $8K out of pocket, not $5K.

Not saying that's the case, just illustrating.

 

[schan2464]

A trade in isn't the same as money. Money has a definite value. A trade in has a range of possible values and the parties agree on one.

What did you trade in? What can he resell it for? If he allowed you $5K but knew (hypothetically) that he could re-sell the car for $8K at auction, then you paid $3k more than you thought you did.

If, again hypothetically, you could have sold the car private party for $8K, then it was $8K out of pocket, not $5K.

Not saying that's the case, just illustrating.

Gotta side with Michael on this one. There is a high degree of certainty that the dealer stands to make more on your trade in than on the sale of the Bolt. I get not wanting to sell a used car on your own, so you chose to trade it in, which is ALWAYS going to yield less than a private sale. I've brought my used cars to Carmax before to get a quote, which I then use as a floor when I sell the car myself. It's a powerful tool to discourage lowballers when they see in my ad how much Carmax has already offered me.

 

[schan2464]

As far as I can tell Schan2464's deal is the best I've heard of. He is paying $410 a month including California tax on a Premier, 15K miles, total cost divided by 36. 4160 off MSRP and 3500 incentives.

Any dealer want to match it, I'm in...PM me

Premier, Silver Ice, Dark interior, DCFC nothing else

Sorry but you are not listening. The MSRP discount and "incentives" don't matter. Only the TOTAL LEASE COST matters for purposes of comparison.

Just based on the monthly lease rental and assuming a 36 month lease and a 8.5% sales tax rate, his total lease cost is $13,604, the deal is still more expensive than mine. How much did he pay up front and how much in rebates did he get? You need to factor those numbers in too before you can make a proper comparison.

Also FWIW, my monthly lease payment is only $305 a month (including tax). That's $105/mo less than the deal you quoted. So, even on those terms, I don't see how that's a better deal than mine.

Was yours a LT or Premier? Can't compare total lease cost unless both were equipped the same way, and same trim. Not to mention the variability of your trade in value.

 

[Schnort]

I'd also add that, in order to make fair comparisons, only the monthly rent before sales tax should be used because almost everyone's sales tax rate is different and some don't even have to pay sales tax on lease payments.

It's important to include tax, since in states like Texas, you pay the entire sales tax up front. This inflates the cost of leasing vs. purchasing.

 

[michael]

I'd also add that, in order to make fair comparisons, only the monthly rent before sales tax should be used because almost everyone's sales tax rate is different and some don't even have to pay sales tax on lease payments.

It's important to include tax, since in states like Texas, you pay the entire sales tax up front. This inflates the cost of leasing vs. purchasing.

Agreed. And furthermore, it's often difficult to compare leases in different areas because there may be local incentives

I'm still looking for a Southern Cal deal on a Premier comparable to Schan's