Chevy Bolt "Broke the Mold"

[GetOffYourGas]

Thought I'd share this article here for discussion:

http://insideevs.com/chevrolet-bolt-designer-says-automaker-broke-mold-mass-market-electric-car/

We broke the mold on the Bolt EV.

And I agree in particular with this statement:

It’s a disaster for aero.

That's what you get for a small-but-tall hatchback. It's terrible for aero. Am I the only one who would prefer something much slicker? The Tesla Model III for example? Tesla built their car to be as aerodynamic as possible. And they ended up with a very sporty look to boot. I understand the Bolt is a more practical form factor, but its highway range will suffer greatly due to poor aerodynamics.

 

[WetEV]

That's what you get for a small-but-tall hatchback. It's terrible for aero. Am I the only one who would prefer something much slicker?

Practical vs better highway range?

Would depend on details. If I had a long freeway commute, I'd take the range. If I mostly drive in town, I'd take the practical.

Room for both. If I someday own two EVs, I might have both.

 

[DucRider]

That's what you get for a small-but-tall hatchback. It's terrible for aero. Am I the only one who would prefer something much slicker? The Tesla Model III for example? Tesla built their car to be as aerodynamic as possible. And they ended up with a very sporty look to boot. I understand the Bolt is a more practical form factor, but its highway range will suffer greatly due to poor aerodynamics.

Yes, some will prefer a sedan over a hatchback, but the biggest criticism I've seen on the 3 is the interior cargo space and small trunk opening. They did at least one redesign to improve it, so we'll see what the "pencils down" final design looks like when they release it.

It's possible Chevy will branch off into a sedan version, and it could be not too long after the Model 3 is available if the demand is there. Personally, I prefer the hatchback, but it would be nice to have one of each in the "fleet" (of 2 cars). I anticipate picking up a Model 3 in three or four years when they get production up to speed and some of the other issues sorted.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

That's what you get for a small-but-tall hatchback. It's terrible for aero. Am I the only one who would prefer something much slicker?

Practical vs better highway range?

Would depend on details. If I had a long freeway commute, I'd take the range. If I mostly drive in town, I'd take the practical.

Room for both. If I someday own two EVs, I might have both.

Yeah, I was really just speaking for myself. My wife is happy with her "mom-mobile" - her words, not mine. I want something a little more fun and engaging to drive. I regularly take 250-300 mile (each way) trips (once or twice a month). I need a car that can get me there. A Bolt can, of course, given I slow down. But I'd prefer to drive the speed limit on the highways (65MPH) to get there in a reasonable amount of time.

For commuting and errands around town, my Leaf will serve me for a good long time. I'm "lucky" (really by my own choice) to live within 3 miles of where I work. And in a large enough town that everything I need is nearby. My interest in the Bolt is not about commuting but about emissions-free and foreign-oil-free traveling.

I anticipate picking up a Model 3 in three or four years when they get production up to speed and some of the other issues sorted.

I'm considering the same, but I'm honestly torn. I'm not convinced that the Model III's cost of ownership will ever match that of the Bolt. Teslas are more expensive to buy, more expensive to maintain, and the service centers are nowhere near me (the latter point likely to change by then). I want to form factor of the Model III (RWD sports sedan) combined with the reliability GM has proven with the Volt.

 

[SeanNelson]

Am I the only one who would prefer something much slicker?

The large number of preorders for the Tesla Model 3 would indicate that you're not.

But the number of Bolt EVs that GM is undoubtedly about to sell will show that there's plenty of room in the market for a more utilitarian vehicle as well.

I'm a "substance over style" guy myself.

 

[Diggle]

Thought I'd share this article here for discussion:

http://insideevs.com/chevrolet-bolt-designer-says-automaker-broke-mold-mass-market-electric-car/

We broke the mold on the Bolt EV.

And I agree in particular with this statement:

It’s a disaster for aero.

That's what you get for a small-but-tall hatchback. It's terrible for aero. Am I the only one who would prefer something much slicker? The Tesla Model III for example? Tesla built their car to be as aerodynamic as possible. And they ended up with a very sporty look to boot. I understand the Bolt is a more practical form factor, but its highway range will suffer greatly due to poor aerodynamics.

Well, that's a very interesting topic to debate. What to choose, practicality or the highway range. I suppose, it depends from customer to customer.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

I'm a "substance over style" guy myself.

Fair enough, but consider that handling and highway range are both "substance" to some.

 

[SeanNelson]

I'm a "substance over style" guy myself.

Fair enough, but consider that handling and highway range are both "substance" to some.

I'm not going to write off the Bolt's highway range until we actually see what its highway range is. All this aerodynamic talk is just pure speculation at this point.

And I'd argue that "handling" is more style than substance, because a car doesn't have to handle well to fulfill its purpose as a transportation device. Handling really only becomes more relevant when you're pushing the car harder than a utilitarian driver such as myself will typically do.

I admit that there's some grey area there when it comes to things like avoiding hazards in an emergency. But even there we're talking about relatively fine shades of differences compared to the everyday value that a car brings to your life.

My name is Sean Nelson, and I approve this opinion.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

My name is Sean Nelson, and I approve this opinion.

I sure am glad to hear that!

I'm not going to argue the subjective merits of each car. Your opinion is just as valid as mine. Just as your desires for your car are just as valid as mine.

As for the aero issue, I know that it's somewhat speculation. But the Cd is reported to be 0.32. The Model III is supposedly 0.20. That's a huge difference. You absolutely would notice the difference on the highway. When you have a GM rep stating that the Bolt's design is "a disaster for aero", that is cause for concern.

We will know the city/highway/combined range very soon. But it's looking possible that the highway range will be less than 200 miles. Of course, maybe they did their homework and got highway range to 200 miles, and that's why combined is well over 200. But that's EPA highway range. For those out west who drive 80+MPH on the highway, I would bet cold hard cash that a Model III will take you farther than a Bolt.

 

[DucRider]

We will know the city/highway/combined range very soon. But it's looking possible that the highway range will be less than 200 miles. Of course, maybe they did their homework and got highway range to 200 miles, and that's why combined is well over 200. But that's EPA highway range. For those out west who drive 80+MPH on the highway, I would bet cold hard cash that a Model III will take you farther than a Bolt.

I wouldn't take that bet. Every Tesla to date has a higher hwy MPGe than city, I can't think of another EV where that's the case.

Re: hwy/city/combined range. We don't get that info on the Monroney label. We DO get hwy/city/combined MPGe, driving range when fully charged, kWh per 100 miles, charge time (240v), greenhouse gas & smog rating.

There are a couple of methods to determine range for EV's, and no easy way to know which a particular manufacturer has chosen.
If you go here http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/download.shtml, you can look at the raw data and get detailed data (by model year). Select the "EV" worksheet and column "BU" will show whether the 5 cycle or 2 cycle test was used. Columns "FH-FJ" will give city/hwy/combined range.
The test data appears to be in columns "N-P" (in two rows for each model - the first is mpge, the second kWh/100m). Those test numbers are derated by 30% (multiply times .7) to give a more accurate number for real world conditions. In theory, vehicles using the 5 cycle test should produce more accurate numbers than those using the 2 cycle test since they add cycles for high speed highway , use of air conditioning, and cold temp driving (but we don't see the data for those?). Note: column references were from the 2015 data file - may be different for other years.

 

[mbepic]

True 'range' will come from each individual owners driving habits, weather related and little things like pumping up the tires, number of passengers and even if they like to drive with the windows open or closed. I'm not so sure why we put so much focus on highway range when we are only talking a relatively short drive to begin with compared to the Chevy Volt, extended range vehicle.

I know that once we experience the 200 miler EV, we will be reaching for a higher standard and eventually the ICE will be replaced completely with electric vehicles..........I'm going with the flow because at this point a few miles plus or minus is neither here nor there.

 

[michael]

As far as I'm concerned, aero isn't such a big deal because you can always compensate by going just a little bit slower. The bigger worry is winter performance, and the big thing a manufacturer can do to help that is provide heat pump rather than resistive heating.

I haven't heard which the Bolt will have, and the silence makes me fear they cheaped out and put in resistive.

As one who has lived with such a system, I promise you it takes a huge bite out of winter range.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

I wouldn't take that bet. Every Tesla to date has a higher hwy MPGe than city, I can't think of another EV where that's the case.

That's not what I said. I said that the Model III would have a higher highway range than the Bolt. I did not say that the Model III would get a better highway range than city range.

 

[Rivu]

GM deserves applause for pulling off the Bolt production. It's a pretty good improvement from other GM cars.

 

[laev]

I'm 6 feet 5 inches most compact cars I don't fit in most vehicles my body length is too tall for so the loss of aerodynamics on the Chevy Bolts is okay with me if I can actually sit in the vehicle

 

[Anonymous]

As far as I'm concerned, aero isn't such a big deal because you can always compensate by going just a little bit slower

Disagree completely. Our Tesla Model S uses less energy on the highway than my Smart ED does, and that's mostly down to the time/design/effort Tesla spent on the aerodynamics. A Model S can cruise at "left lane" speeds for long distances with high efficiency, which makes road trips far more convenient when chargers are 200km+ apart. Going slower is a penalty that most drivers will not accept when they are driving more than the full charge range of the car, as the less efficient car will need longer charging time.

 

[elpwr]

The Bolt's configuration is entirely appropriate for many users. The aero sacrifice results in a vehicle that has a much smaller footprint but nearly the same interior room as my Tesla Model S.

The Bolt isn't intended for extended trips at "left lane speeds". Instead, it a compact vehicle with lots of usable interior room. This will be more important than ultimate highway range for many users.

 

[stephen]

The Bolt's configuration is entirely appropriate for many users. The aero sacrifice results in a vehicle that has a much smaller footprint but nearly the same interior room as my Tesla Model S.

The Bolt isn't intended for extended trips at "left lane speeds". Instead, it a compact vehicle with lots of usable interior room. This will be more important than ultimate highway range for many users.

So, would you trade your Model S for a Bolt EV?

 

[elpwr]

Wouldn't trade the Tesla for a Bolt but sure intend to buy a Bolt. I'm expecting it to be a useful addition. It it might get as much, or more, use as my Tesla.

 

[MINK]

Aside from all the criticism Chevy Bolt faces, it's still the best in that price range.