Trip Report - My First 250 Round Trip Commute to Work

[iankh]

I thought I'd provide an update since it's been a while.

I'm still commuting every week from Palm Springs to Carlsbad and topping up in Carlsbad has not been a problem, In theory, my Bolt, Faraday, says he's got enough juice for the return trip, but I still prefer to top up. Not quite sure why the 2 DC Fast sources I use, Chargepoint and EVgo only allow a top up to 80%. What's behind that.

Today it's a chilly 104F here and will be up around 108F when I next make the journey. Fortunately, it's not that hot when I leave at 4:00 AM. On the way back, it's pretty cool by the coast and doesn't start to warm up until I hit Hemet. I am wondering how the AC is going to impact my range?

Also, last week, here in Palm Springs, something new appeared in the energy usage, "Conditioning". What's that about? I thought that applied to cold weather. It has only happened when I've parked outside in a parking lot, and only when it's been about 100F or so.

 

[SparkE]

Not quite sure why the 2 DC Fast sources I use, Chargepoint and EVgo only allow a top up to 80%. What's behind that.

I believe that the CAR does that, not the DCFC charger itself. Is anybody else seeing the same thing (can't fast charge beyond 80% SoC)? Is it a vehicle setting/parameter?

Also, last week, here in Palm Springs, something new appeared in the energy usage, "Conditioning". What's that about? I thought that applied to cold weather. It has only happened when I've parked outside in a parking lot, and only when it's been about 100F or so.

The "conditioning" percentage is electricity used while NOT plugged in to keep your battery inside a range of temperatures (not too cold, not too hot) in order to promote battery life. If you are plugged in, the energy comes from the 'wall' and not the battery. If you *aren't* plugged in, the battery cooling system will still turn on, to make sure that the battery doesn't get too hot. (Does anybody know if the 'cooling system' kicks in at a lower temp if the car is plugged in to a charging source?)

 

[ScooterCT]

The Bolt battery, and actually most liquid electrolyte lithium batteries, must be maintained within a specified temperature range. So the battery will be cooled when needed, just as it's heated with needed. There are promising solid electrolyte batteries that don't have this limitation (and don't require all the ancillary equipment/cost/weight), but you now what "promising" means (promising is something that will appear the day after you're buried).

 

[iankh]

Something did happen yesterday afternoon when I got back from running errands. It was about 106F out and my garage is not cooled. I plugged in the car to my JuiceBox (40amp) and a short while later received a message that charging had been interrupted. I went out the garage and the Bolt was making more than just a fan noise, I don't know how to describe it, but it sounded course. I unplugged the car and decided to wait to plug it in when I went to bed, since this time of year it cools down to the 80s (in the summer it cools down to the 90s). It seemed to charge just fine overnight. Not sure what that noise was that I heard, but it did not sound normal to me. There have been lots of postings on this forum about the Bolt and cold or extreme cold but nothing that I can find about extreme heat. It is not unusual for us out here in the Palm Springs area to have some days when the temperature goes as high as 121F, the the norm is more around 105F to about 110F. I wonder if I should post this on the charging forum?

I'm leasing my Bolt. The first time I've ever leased a car. My decision was based on abou 50% of hedging against technology changes, and 50% not knowing what batteries would do in extreme summer heat.

 

[DucRider]

Something did happen yesterday afternoon when I got back from running errands. It was about 106F out and my garage is not cooled. I plugged in the car to my JuiceBox (40amp) and a short while later received a message that charging had been interrupted. I went out the garage and the Bolt was making more than just a fan noise, I don't know how to describe it, but it sounded course. I unplugged the car and decided to wait to plug it in when I went to bed, since this time of year it cools down to the 80s (in the summer it cools down to the 90s). It seemed to charge just fine overnight. Not sure what that noise was that I heard, but it did not sound normal to me. There have been lots of postings on this forum about the Bolt and cold or extreme cold but nothing that I can find about extreme heat. It is not unusual for us out here in the Palm Springs area to have some days when the temperature goes as high as 121F, the the norm is more around 105F to about 110F. I wonder if I should post this on the charging forum?

I'm leasing my Bolt. The first time I've ever leased a car. My decision was based on abou 50% of hedging against technology changes, and 50% not knowing what batteries would do in extreme summer heat.

From pg 231 of the users manual:

It is recommended that
the vehicle be plugged in when
temperatures are below 0 °C (32 °F)
and above 32 °C (90 °F) to
maximize high voltage battery life.

Heat is a very big factor in battery degradation (one of the reasons the passively cooled LEAF had issues). The Bolt has 3 separate cooling systems. It is likely that 2 of those were active (battery and charger/inverter). The car will interupt charging to protect the batteries when things get too hot. It probably would have been better to leave it plugged in to facilitate the cooling process.

Might be worth an ask at the dealer about the noise. If it does it again, maybe record a little clip on your phone to document it? EV's can make a lot of strange noises when charging (particularly when hot) and it can be disconcerting to those not used to them. Former LEAF owners are often most taken aback since the LEAF doesn't have any active cooling.

 

[sparkyps]

I thought I'd provide an update since it's been a while.

I'm still commuting every week from Palm Springs to Carlsbad and topping up in Carlsbad has not been a problem, In theory, my Bolt, Faraday, says he's got enough juice for the return trip, but I still prefer to top up. Not quite sure why the 2 DC Fast sources I use, Chargepoint and EVgo only allow a top up to 80%. What's behind that.

Today it's a chilly 104F here and will be up around 108F when I next make the journey. Fortunately, it's not that hot when I leave at 4:00 AM. On the way back, it's pretty cool by the coast and doesn't start to warm up until I hit Hemet. I am wondering how the AC is going to impact my range?

Also, last week, here in Palm Springs, something new appeared in the energy usage, "Conditioning". What's that about? I thought that applied to cold weather. It has only happened when I've parked outside in a parking lot, and only when it's been about 100F or so.

Very nice, I'm also in the Palm Springs area and I made the trip to Carlsbad in my Spark EV once. A few more stops to charge than you made.
Haven't made it in our Bolt yet, if you see a Cajun Red Bolt LT in the Palm Springs area wave, it's probably my wife or me.

My experience driving in the heat with the Spark EV is that the AC has a really minimal impact on range, I was pleasantly surprised.

When it is hot the battery conditioning system tries to keep the battery pack cooler.

80% is a common level that an EV can be charged to at it's max DC charging rate. In the Bolt it is a bit more complex, the max charge rate drops sooner than 80%. Since the EVgo DCFC chargers charge by the minute, unless you need as much range as possible you don't want to charge when the rate starts falling off substantially or you start paying a lot more for your power. Given where you are going to and from you may not want to charge at Carlsbad when you still have more than 50% range prior to returning to Palm Springs. There are two convenient EVgo chargers in Moreno Valley and you'll be able to pick up some quick max charge rate range there if you don't think you can make it to Palm Springs without recharging. You can comfortably make it back to the desert from Moreno Valley with 70 miles of range so no need to charge for more time than you care to as long as you can charge up at home sufficiently, if you are charging at home with the 110V adapter that came with the care it would be understandable to charge more at the last DCFC station before getting home.

There are also DCFC stations that I've frequently used in Cabazon, one at the outlet mall and another at the nearby Indian casino.

 

[sparkyps]

Another comment, if you don't mind driving through the mountains, I much prefer going to/from Palm Springs to the San Diego/Carlsbad area through the mountains on Highway 74. It is quite a bit shorter and you could likely make the R/T without recharging at all as long as you are fully charged at each end. The road is a bit slower and not great for driving on after dark but since it is slower speed you will not only be driving a shorter distance but be getting really great miles per kwh.

For example, I regularly make the trip from the Palm Desert area to Temecula in my Spark EV. It's about a 70 mile trip, you gain some altitude which should cost you some range, but even after 40,000 and 3 years in my Spark (slight battery degradation) I can make it to the Temecula DCFC with over 15 miles of range showing when I get there. That is in an 83 mile rated Spark EV.

We've made the trip to La Jolla in the Bolt using Highway 74 and got to La Jolla with 157 miles of indicated range left, that's after driving 120 miles to get there.

 

[SeanNelson]

I went out the garage and the Bolt was making more than just a fan noise, I don't know how to describe it, but it sounded course.

The Bolt cools its battery with a liquid cooling system. That requires both a fan to cool the liquid and a pump to move it around. The noise you heard may have been the pump.

 

[iankh]

Something did happen yesterday afternoon when I got back from running errands. It was about 106F out and my garage is not cooled. I plugged in the car to my JuiceBox (40amp) and a short while later received a message that charging had been interrupted. I went out the garage and the Bolt was making more than just a fan noise, I don't know how to describe it, but it sounded course. I unplugged the car and decided to wait to plug it in when I went to bed, since this time of year it cools down to the 80s (in the summer it cools down to the 90s). It seemed to charge just fine overnight. Not sure what that noise was that I heard, but it did not sound normal to me. There have been lots of postings on this forum about the Bolt and cold or extreme cold but nothing that I can find about extreme heat. It is not unusual for us out here in the Palm Springs area to have some days when the temperature goes as high as 121F, the the norm is more around 105F to about 110F. I wonder if I should post this on the charging forum?

I'm leasing my Bolt. The first time I've ever leased a car. My decision was based on abou 50% of hedging against technology changes, and 50% not knowing what batteries would do in extreme summer heat.

From pg 231 of the users manual:

It is recommended that
the vehicle be plugged in when
temperatures are below 0 °C (32 °F)
and above 32 °C (90 °F) to
maximize high voltage battery life.

Heat is a very big factor in battery degradation (one of the reasons the passively cooled LEAF had issues). The Bolt has 3 separate cooling systems. It is likely that 2 of those were active (battery and charger/inverter). The car will interupt charging to protect the batteries when things get too hot. It probably would have been better to leave it plugged in to facilitate the cooling process.

Might be worth an ask at the dealer about the noise. If it does it again, maybe record a little clip on your phone to document it? EV's can make a lot of strange noises when charging (particularly when hot) and it can be disconcerting to those not used to them. Former LEAF owners are often most taken aback since the LEAF doesn't have any active cooling.

Gary - Your posting was extremely helpful. I had no idea that the manual recommended keeping it plugged in when the temperature was above 90F/23C, which is nearly every day here in Palm Springs from late May through Mid November. I had wondered whether it was good or bad to keep it plugged in when in the garage. Now I know, and will do so.

 

[iankh]

Another comment, if you don't mind driving through the mountains, I much prefer going to/from Palm Springs to the San Diego/Carlsbad area through the mountains on Highway 74. It is quite a bit shorter and you could likely make the R/T without recharging at all as long as you are fully charged at each end. The road is a bit slower and not great for driving on after dark but since it is slower speed you will not only be driving a shorter distance but be getting really great miles per kwh.

For example, I regularly make the trip from the Palm Desert area to Temecula in my Spark EV. It's about a 70 mile trip, you gain some altitude which should cost you some range, but even after 40,000 and 3 years in my Spark (slight battery degradation) I can make it to the Temecula DCFC with over 15 miles of range showing when I get there. That is in an 83 mile rated Spark EV.

We've made the trip to La Jolla in the Bolt using Highway 74 and got to La Jolla with 157 miles of indicated range left, that's after driving 120 miles to get there.

I have to let it be known that I am just chicken about driving on the 74. I think going to Carlsbad would be better because it's the inside lane against the mountain, but coming home in the dark with nothing but a drop on the driver side and cars up my butt because I'm driving slowly scares me.

I have found that I can trim about 20 miles off the drive by taking a route that takes me on the 111 to the 10, and then to the 79 though Hemt to the 15, and then getting off and going through Bonsall working my way down to Carlsbad. It's about 20 minutes longer or so, but has saved me about 40 miles on the roundtrip, plus I find the drive more enjoyable and relaxing.

I admire your courage regularly going over the 74.

 

[iankh]

I thought I'd provide an update since it's been a while.

I'm still commuting every week from Palm Springs to Carlsbad and topping up in Carlsbad has not been a problem, In theory, my Bolt, Faraday, says he's got enough juice for the return trip, but I still prefer to top up. Not quite sure why the 2 DC Fast sources I use, Chargepoint and EVgo only allow a top up to 80%. What's behind that.

Today it's a chilly 104F here and will be up around 108F when I next make the journey. Fortunately, it's not that hot when I leave at 4:00 AM. On the way back, it's pretty cool by the coast and doesn't start to warm up until I hit Hemet. I am wondering how the AC is going to impact my range?

Also, last week, here in Palm Springs, something new appeared in the energy usage, "Conditioning". What's that about? I thought that applied to cold weather. It has only happened when I've parked outside in a parking lot, and only when it's been about 100F or so.

Very nice, I'm also in the Palm Springs area and I made the trip to Carlsbad in my Spark EV once. A few more stops to charge than you made.
Haven't made it in our Bolt yet, if you see a Cajun Red Bolt LT in the Palm Springs area wave, it's probably my wife or me.

My experience driving in the heat with the Spark EV is that the AC has a really minimal impact on range, I was pleasantly surprised.

When it is hot the battery conditioning system tries to keep the battery pack cooler.

80% is a common level that an EV can be charged to at it's max DC charging rate. In the Bolt it is a bit more complex, the max charge rate drops sooner than 80%. Since the EVgo DCFC chargers charge by the minute, unless you need as much range as possible you don't want to charge when the rate starts falling off substantially or you start paying a lot more for your power. Given where you are going to and from you may not want to charge at Carlsbad when you still have more than 50% range prior to returning to Palm Springs. There are two convenient EVgo chargers in Moreno Valley and you'll be able to pick up some quick max charge rate range there if you don't think you can make it to Palm Springs without recharging. You can comfortably make it back to the desert from Moreno Valley with 70 miles of range so no need to charge for more time than you care to as long as you can charge up at home sufficiently, if you are charging at home with the 110V adapter that came with the care it would be understandable to charge more at the last DCFC station before getting home.

There are also DCFC stations that I've frequently used in Cabazon, one at the outlet mall and another at the nearby Indian casino.

I know there's a DCFC at the McDonalds off the 10 in I think Banning that I could use in a pinch. At home, I have L2, 40 Amps, so charge fairly quickly.

I think that considering I leave work by 3 or 3:30 for the drive home and normally walk in the door between 6:35 and 6:45 that makes me hesitant to do a stop on the way home to add range.

I didn

 

[DanCar]

Hi Ian,

Thanks for the informative reports. I'm a little puzzled, just sped red, so likely I didn't catch something. You seem paranoid about the drive but you get to your destination with 80 miles to spare. Why?

 

[iankh]

Hi Ian,

Thanks for the informative reports. I'm a little puzzled, just sped red, so likely I didn't catch something. You seem paranoid about the drive but you get to your destination with 80 miles to spare. Why?

I usually have about 100 miles or more when I arrive at work. My paranoia stems from fear of not having the range to get back because I drive over mountains and now that summer is here will need to start running the AC for at least half of the drive home. Hence why I top up to 80% in Carlsbad.

 

[SparkE]

Gary - Your posting was extremely helpful. I had no idea that the manual recommended keeping it plugged in when the temperature was above 90F/23C, which is nearly every day here in Palm Springs from late May through Mid November. I had wondered whether it was good or bad to keep it plugged in when in the garage. Now I know, and will do so.

If you are going to generally leave your car plugged in, I would highly suggest setting 'Hill Top Reserve' charging (to protect against battery degradation). Keeping the battery cooled is important for long battery life; as is NOT allowing the battery to sit at a 100% charge for long periods - especially when hot; as is not charging when extremely hot - better to plug in just before going to bed (or set the timer to only charge between, say, 12-6am) on hot days (IF you will have enough time to get the charge you need/want for the next day).

'Hill Top Reserve' stops charging the battery at (about) 90%. You can set the preference to only do 'Hill Top Reserve' when charging only at home. (Obviously, you would want to turn off 'Hill Top Reserve' mode the night before going on a long drive ....)

Is it possible to temporarily over-ride 'Hill Top Reserve' the same way that one can override delayed charging (timer charging) - unplug the charge cord from the charge port and then plug it back in within five seconds???

 

[iankh]

Gary - Your posting was extremely helpful. I had no idea that the manual recommended keeping it plugged in when the temperature was above 90F/23C, which is nearly every day here in Palm Springs from late May through Mid November. I had wondered whether it was good or bad to keep it plugged in when in the garage. Now I know, and will do so.

If you are going to generally leave your car plugged in, I would highly suggest setting 'Hill Top Reserve' charging (to protect against battery degradation). Keeping the battery cooled is important for long battery life; as is NOT allowing the battery to sit at a 100% charge for long periods - especially when hot; as is not charging when extremely hot - better to plug in just before going to bed (or set the timer to only charge between, say, 12-6am) on hot days (IF you will have enough time to get the charge you need/want for the next day).

'Hill Top Reserve' stops charging the battery at (about) 90%. You can set the preference to only do 'Hill Top Reserve' when charging only at home. (Obviously, you would want to turn off 'Hill Top Reserve' mode the night before going on a long drive ....)

Is it possible to temporarily over-ride 'Hill Top Reserve' the same way that one can override delayed charging (timer charging) - unplug the charge cord from the charge port and then plug it back in within five seconds???

Thank you very much for the information. I've changed my settings to turn on Hill Top Reserve when the car is at home, and also set up charing to start at 12:00 AM and go to 6:00 AM which is when it will be at the coolest outside. I should still be able to get to Carlsbad and with the top up there to 80% be able to get home.

I also set it up with a summer and winter schedule, with winter beginning November 15th and summer starting May 1st.

 

[iankh]

Actually the manual says that the car should be plugged in when it's above 90F. Does this mean is should be in a charge mode or not in a charge mode?

 

[SparkE]

Actually the manual says that the car should be plugged in when it's above 90F. Does this mean is should be in a charge mode or not in a charge mode?

It doesn't say, but I would assume it doesn't matter. I *believe* that when the car is plugged in, it will pull energy from the wall (via the EVSE) to cool down the battery instead of using the energy stored in the battery itself. (Does anybody know if the battering conditioning starts *earlier* {or cools to a lower temp} if the car is plugged in, compared to it NOT being plugged in???) At any rate, I would *expect* that the battery cooling system would turn on and cool the battery if the car is plugged in - whether the vehicle is currently charging or not.

Note that even if you set delayed charging (using the Departure charge mode, Latest Possible Charge Completion) the car MAY start charging immediately (or at least sooner than you would expect) if the battery is pretty empty because it calculates how much time is needed to fully charge the vehicle (or charge to 90% if hilltop mode is set) and will start charging so that you have a 'complete charge' by your set departure time.

Also, there is a 'Priority Charging' setting which will immediately start charging your battery if it is below 40% full (if it is set); it will ignore the delayed charging and charge until the battery gets to 40% (if needed) then stop at 40% and resume charging once the 'delayed charging' parameters are matched.

I'm not sure how 'bad' it is to charge a low-SoC (State of Charge) battery to 40% when it is really hot outside (say, over 90 degrees). Which is worse : letting the battery get hot, or charging when it is hot? I don't know. It might be a good idea to use the 120V EVSE that came with the vehicle in such cases : the battery would be protected (because it is plugged in when hot) and the battery would be charging at a very low rate (120V/8 amps compared to 240V/30 amps) when it is hot outside. Or maybe it would be better to temporarily disable the 'Priority Charging' setting so that the car wouldn't charge at all in those few, rare cases when your car's battery is <40% and it is really hot outside??? (But that would mean that when you want to take the car somewhere, you would have a very low drivability range.) Every morning you *should* start the day with a 90/100% charge (it just charged all night on your 40 Amp EVSE). So this would be an issue only those times that you drove the car for 130 miles or so during the day and then went home to palm springs (or anywhere it was 110 degrees) and wanted to drive 100 or more miles before it cooled down.

At any rate, whenever you mess with the charging parameters, it would be a good idea to keep a close eye on your charge every night (i.e., when you plug in) and every morning (say, when you get up) to make sure you don't get surprised by low (or no) charge when you want to go somewhere. Remember that there is a one-time override ("charge right NOW!!") you can activate by unpluging the charge cord from the car and immediately plugging it back in (within five seconds).

 

[devbolt]

The climate control system pulls about 2 kW max when the A/C is running. Normal operation should be around 1 kW or less once the cabin is at a comfortable temperature. At full charge I have 210 miles of range with the A/C off. If I turn on the A/C, it drops to 200 miles, or about a 5% hit.

 

[JeremyK]

Regarding charging when at a low SOC at high ambient temperature. Definitely yes. When the car is charging it will also condition/ cool the battery pack. Under any extreme temperature, the car should be plugged in, even if not charging to take advantage of battery conditioning.